Deep in the Heart of Taxes
Last Post 15 Mar 2009 09:07 AM by Road Block. 154 Replies.
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183eejUser is Offline
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30 Jan 2009 05:45 PM

In case everyone was not aware, the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 included removal of the $2,000 cap on the 30% tax credit for geothermal installations that was passed into law last fall.  Under the old law, a $20,000 system would get a tax credit of $2,000.  Under this law, the same $20,000 system will get a $6,000 tax credit.

The house passed the bill Weds evening and President Obama supports the house bill.  The Senate is poised to debate the bill next week and everyone has promised the President they would have the bill ready for him to sign by mid-Feb.

I think the significance of this change is difficult to understate.  If it passes, and it looks like it will, this is huge.

Here is where you can track the bills progress if you are interested http://www.opencongress.org/

Dale Walker
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geo fanUser is Offline
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30 Jan 2009 06:19 PM
GREAT NEWS
In ct where the average install in 40k or more This is jaw droping

Long Live Obama
thaas53User is Offline
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31 Jan 2009 12:11 PM
Any idea if this will be backdated to include installs in 2008?
183eejUser is Offline
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31 Jan 2009 12:33 PM
No indication yet that I have seen.  We may not know the details until the bill get's through the Senate and the House and Senate bill is reconciled.  Last fall's bill was retroactive to the 1st of Jan-08.  However, as a jobs stimulus bill, this one may not.  We'll just have to wait and see.
Dale Walker
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thevinmanfxstUser is Offline
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31 Jan 2009 02:04 PM
On an 08 install, if you claim the old current credit for 2k, will you be out of luck for the new credit???
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31 Jan 2009 02:10 PM
I'd doubt it. That's a significant amount. It'd most likely be retroactive to all, even if some have already claimed the $2K--IF it's retroactive.
Clark Timothy (clark@pinksdx.com)
VP sales, Tuff Luck Geothermal Drilling
Geothermal Heat Pumps: Heating and Cooling that's Dirt Cheap!
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BrockUser is Offline
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31 Jan 2009 03:56 PM
Or leave your system off for all of 2008 and "turn it on" now, in 2009 and claim it in 2009, if you can do that...
Green Bay, WI. - 4 ton horizontal, 16k gallon indoor pool, 1.8kw solar PV setup, 3400 sq ft
robinncUser is Offline
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31 Jan 2009 07:54 PM
This is GREAT news!!

geo........avg.. of 40 grand??...WOW... residential?
geodeanUser is Offline
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31 Jan 2009 08:13 PM
My biggest fear is that an incentive like this will bring even more hacks into the business.
Dewayne Dean
www.PalaceGeothermal.com
Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%
We heat and cool with dirt!
visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system
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31 Jan 2009 09:34 PM
Posted By thaas53 on 01/31/2009 12:11 PM
Any idea if this will be backdated to include installs in 2008?

Since the bill is still active, write to your state senators and encourage them to make it so.  After all, the tax relief we get for the 2008 tax year is going to impact the 2009 cash flow (it will for me, at any rate!).


http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
geo fanUser is Offline
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01 Feb 2009 08:58 AM

If it where to fallow the Solar tax change ( which simply removed the cap )

No wording would be changed except to remove the "up to 2000"

the senate has plegded to have it on the Pres. desk by the end of the month

with out a fillabuster of course , if that is true and all goes well should be applicable for 08 returns

geo fanUser is Offline
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01 Feb 2009 09:41 AM
 

Long-Term Extension of Energy Property Tax Credit — Section 48 of the Tax Code provides tax credits (in addition to the PTC) for investments in energy property. The 2008 Act expands the scope of qualified energy property, removed or raised the caps on this tax credit, and extended the sunset for the credit in certain instances. Specifically, the Act extends through 2016 the 30 percent tax credit for investments in solar energy property and fuel cell property and the 10 percent tax credit for commercial microturbines. The Act amends the definition of energy property to provide a new 10 percent investment tax credit for combined heat and power sources and geothermal equipment that uses ground water for heating or cooling purposes. The Act also increases the tax credit available for investments in qualified fuel cells from $500 to $1,500 per half KW.

Long-Term Extension and Modification of the Residential Energy-Efficient Property Tax Credit — Section 25D of the Tax Code allows for a 30 percent credit for investments in residential solar and fuel cell properties. The 2008 Act extends through 2016 the credit available for solar property and adds residential small wind and geothermal heat pumps as qualifying property. Significantly, the Act eliminates the $2,000 cap on the 30 percent tax credit available for solar facilities; the credit can now be applied to the total cost of photovoltaic solar facilities.

geo fanUser is Offline
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01 Feb 2009 11:04 AM
http://readthestimulus.org/index.php?query=geothermal+tax

Here is a good link to the actual stimulus in which you can search for specific words
near as I can tell 08 installs are covered at least for the 30% maybe not for the new additional 10%
hopefully somebody a little smarter can sift though that and let me know
wirechiefUser is Offline
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01 Feb 2009 05:51 PM
I read in one news article this.
Both the House and Senate versions have other, indirect benefits for renewable energy, though, because they allow taxpayers to apply current losses to tax returns they filed up to five years ago. If the provision passes, a business that didn't make money this year could take the tax credits they received for investing in clean energy and apply them to the taxes they paid in a previous year when they did make a profit

That could be a good sign, I am not sure being able to take the credit for prior years (up to 5 years) applys to customers who would not normally qualify
because they didn't have taxable income for the year in question or not. I know it would be a benefit for me.
1500 sq ft home with 5 ton Geocomfort heat pump
desuperheater,3200ft of horz loop. Howard city,MI.
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01 Feb 2009 08:19 PM
Posted By thevinmanfxst on 01/31/2009 2:04 PM
On an 08 install, if you claim the old current credit for 2k, will you be out of luck for the new credit???

If you already filed, you would just have to file an amended return to get the extra write off. I just got the final piece of paperwork to file my tax return and I was ready to set up an appointment with my tax accountant. But based on this new news, I will hold off for a few weeks to see what happens.
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01 Feb 2009 08:41 PM
Posted By 183eej on 01/30/2009 5:45 PM

In case everyone was not aware, the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 included removal of the $2,000 cap on the 30% tax credit for geothermal installations that was passed into law last fall.  Under the old law, a $20,000 system would get a tax credit of $2,000.  Under this law, the same $20,000 system will get a $6,000 tax credit.


I've looked over the available links on the bill and No where can I see it specifics this. Any chance you can qoute this. I see any provisions for Geothermal, but Geothermal isn't the same thing as Geothermal heat pumps. When they are talking about geothermal, I beleive they are referring to Geothermal energy generating stations.

183eejUser is Offline
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01 Feb 2009 10:37 PM

What I saw was an email from John Kelly at the Geothermal Heat Pump Consortium to the GHPC board on January 20th that was forwarded to me by staff at the SMU Geothermal Lab.  Here is the pertinent language from that email:

Removal of dollar limitations on certain energy credits. Under current law, businesses are allowed to claim a thirty percent (30%) tax credit for qualified small wind energy property (capped at $4,000). Individuals are allowed to claim a thirty percent (30%) tax credit for qualified solar water heating property (capped at $2,000), qualified small wind energy property (capped at $500 per kilowatt of capacity, up to $4,000), and qualified geothermal heat pumps (capped at $2,000). The bill would repeal the individual dollar caps. As a result, each of these properties would be eligible for an uncapped thirty percent (30%) credit.

In the full text version of the bill online, I didn't see all of this specific language.  However, under Subtitle G, Part 1, Section 1603, it did reference a repeal of certain limitations on credit for renewable energy property which is how John led off the above paragraph.  Please see below

Subtitle G--Energy Incentives

Part 1--Renewable Energy Incentives

      Sec. 1601. Extension of credit for electricity produced from certain renewable resources.

      Sec. 1602. Election of investment credit in lieu of production credit.

                    Sec. 1603. Repeal of certain limitations on credit for renewable energy property.


I'm guessing (hoping may be more like it) that the full text you and I are looking at online is not entirely "full text."  We'll know here shortly though.  The Senate is scheduled to take it up this week and has promised a bill for the President to sign in mid-Feb.  In the mean time, you might want to call your Senator and let him/her know how you feel about this provision.

Dale Walker
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www.earthtapenergy.com
Where the sun never sets on energy savings
joe.amiUser is Offline
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01 Feb 2009 10:40 PM
Thanks Dale,
A good reminder to everyone to call their reps as well.
J
Just a Mechanic;
Geothermal; Savings Underfoot
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02 Feb 2009 10:14 AM
This would be significant. Thanks for pointing this out Dale.
Keeping my fingers crossed!
Ona
just trying to make my old home better
www.geochoices.com
davetUser is Offline
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02 Feb 2009 10:12 PM
Assuming this passes and is retroactive for 2008 installs, does any know if the full 30% credit can be claimed on this year's tax return, or should one just get the $2000 this year and the balance next year or thru an amended return?
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