Watch out for Egg Geothermal
Last Post 12 Apr 2015 11:29 AM by joe.ami. 44 Replies.
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cgalUser is Offline
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21 Aug 2012 09:57 PM
Please be careful if you are considering doing business with Egg Geothermal. I gave them a $27K deposit for a 4 unit (total 14 ton) geothermal system in Florida. They used none of the money for my system. They subcontracted out all the work and paid none of the subcontractors. I had to pay the well driller and the plumber directly. The sub who actually ran my ducting and installed my units now has a lien for $29K against my house. I had to pay another HVAC company to commission the system. I have since found postings on the ripoff report website: http://www.ripoffreport.com/consumer-services/egg-systems/egg-systems-egg-systems-geothe-290d0.htm AND http://www.ripoffreport.com/egg-geothermal-syste/advertising-deceptive/egg-geothermal-systems-egg-sys-0c00b.htm
engineerUser is Offline
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21 Aug 2012 10:23 PM
Wow!

Consider filing a complaint with the Florida Construction Industry Licensing Board
Curt Kinder <br><br>

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
cgalUser is Offline
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21 Aug 2012 10:39 PM
Thanks. We'll look into that. We've already filed a report with the BBB. Our damage is done. I'd just like to help others avoid making the same mistake.
robinncUser is Offline
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21 Aug 2012 11:05 PM
Sounds like gypsies.
engineerUser is Offline
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22 Aug 2012 08:19 AM
They are not - they've been around awhile - very impressive website.

If they failed to pay subs as you say, that's a serious matter and the licensing board WILL take notice.

I found no listing for Jay Egg or Egg geo on licensing board website, so this might be a matter of unlicensed contracting, another major no-no.

I strongly advise involving state on this - we pay hundreds every for licensing, in part so that the state has the resources to run down scammers
Curt Kinder <br><br>

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
joe.amiUser is Offline
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22 Aug 2012 09:05 AM
That stinks.
In MI we all pay to the construction lein fund which is for this sort of occasion- the state actually will release money for completion/repair of installs and go after contractor for you.

Joe Hardin
www.amicontracting.com
We Dig Comfort!
www.doityourselfgeothermal.com
Dig Your Own Comfort!
geomeUser is Offline
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22 Aug 2012 09:21 AM
In addition to filing complaints with the state, have you investigated legal action?
Homeowner with WF Envision NDV038 (packaged) & NDZ026 (split), one 3000' 4 pipe closed horizontal ground loop, Prestige thermostats, desuperheaters, 85 gal. Marathon.
Palace GeothermalUser is Offline
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22 Aug 2012 09:46 AM
Posted By joe.ami on 22 Aug 2012 09:05 AM
That stinks.
In MI we all pay to the construction lein fund which is for this sort of occasion- the state actually will release money for completion/repair of installs and go after contractor for you.


Utah has the same program.
Dewayne Dean

<br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system
waterpirateUser is Offline
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23 Aug 2012 06:09 AM
I met them a couple years ago when they showed up in my OA via computer and telephone to help fix a failed closed loop commercial project to open loop. They called me for pricing on a project that were not willing to talk about location or specifics???? I steared clear.

OP
I would get a lawyer involved and file every peice of paper possible to ensure that if they attempt to sell their toothbrush at the swap meet, you get the proceeds. this is so baaaad.
Eric
Eric Sackett<br>www.weberwelldrilling.com<br >Visit our Geothermal Resource Center!
ICFHybridUser is Offline
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23 Aug 2012 10:37 AM
Is the same "Egg" who thought he discovered geothermal air conditioning in 1989?

That's who the "ripoff" reports are pointing to, anyway.

They are a major, multistate contractor with licensing.
cgalUser is Offline
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23 Aug 2012 03:16 PM
Yes the same (bad) Egg. The owner's name is Jay Egg. He published a book with McGraw Hill, "Geothermal HVAC, Green Heating and Cooling" (c) 2011. The "About the Authors" section says he started the company in 1990 and has since "successfully installed thousands of geothermal HVAC systems for residential and commercial customers, in the Tampa, Orlando, and Atlanta regions - and beyond." You are right - he does have an impressive website. We are talking to an attorney but I am pessimistic about any net recovery. Currently, I just want to try and contribute a little bad news about him to the internet so people like me that do an internet search on him will come across it. When I was looking, I didn't find one negative report. I'm also trying to resolve some installation issues with my system. The installation of the plumbing doesn't seem to match up with what the ClimateMaster installation manual says to do and I have a LOT of water noise in the pipes. I'm trying to get the ClimateMaster Southeast Regional rep to come visit my installation and give me some counsel. I've considered starting a new thread here to get advice here as well. I'll see how I fair with the ClimateMaster rep first.
Clark
joe.amiUser is Offline
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24 Aug 2012 09:09 AM
Let's seperate some things.

1) If you are having trouble with the system I think it's ok to contact the sub contractors and ask them to fix it. If you have loop noise, call whoever fixed it.

2) Someone who is multistate may simply operate on the licenses of his subs.

3) I find it unreasonable to assume someone who takes down payments and simply walks with it stays in biz 20 yrs. I find it reasonable to assume someone with multi state branches has a large volume of customers, meaning greater number of installs and problems. The more installs you have the more exposure you have to breakdowns or dissatisfaction. It's a rule of numbers.

4) If the money you owe the duct guy was greater than the down stroke then you were going to owe the plumber and driller anyway so you are piling on a little unless you were given the impression that 27K was the total.

Multiple branches and lovely trappings and web sites are often the trappings of marketing (vs service) companies. While that doesn't mean market firms don't service their customers their focus is charge more to meet more to sell to more customers.



Joe Hardin
www.amicontracting.com
We Dig Comfort!
www.doityourselfgeothermal.com
Dig Your Own Comfort!
ICFHybridUser is Offline
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24 Aug 2012 09:41 AM
Yes the same (bad) Egg.
Aside from the humor about the name, how does all this work? Doesn't the contractor have a bonding requirement? With all this liening going on, how does the contractor's bond survive, and hence, his professional licensure?
joe.amiUser is Offline
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24 Aug 2012 10:16 AM
Bonds are not common for HVAC projects in my AO. They are usually associated with the building permit. If the builder vs homeowner happened to employ the Egg, then it might matter.
Joe Hardin
www.amicontracting.com
We Dig Comfort!
www.doityourselfgeothermal.com
Dig Your Own Comfort!
Palace GeothermalUser is Offline
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24 Aug 2012 11:01 AM
in my 40 years as a contractor, I have never had to post a bond to get a job. Bonds are usually associated with large commercial jobs in my area.
Dewayne Dean

<br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system
ICFHybridUser is Offline
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24 Aug 2012 01:06 PM
Licensure in this state (WA) requires a bond. If your bond is accessed, like might happen if you didn't pay the subcontractors, your license becomes invalid.
cgalUser is Offline
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24 Aug 2012 05:36 PM
>Let's seperate some things.
>
>1) If you are having trouble with the system I think it's ok to contact the sub contractors and ask them to fix it. If you have loop noise, call whoever fixed it.

Certainly a reasonable thought. The subcontractor who did most of the work is the one who didn't get paid and is unwilling to do anything until he is paid in full. I've been holding off doing that because I wanted Egg to pay him. In addition, supposedly they are the ones that told the plumber how to run the plumbing that seems to be at odds with the ClimateMaster install instructions and includes valves that are not rated for the gpm of one of the units. I think it is prudent to get a second opinion first which is why I'm trying to work with ClimateMaster directly.


>3) I find it unreasonable to assume someone who takes down payments and simply walks with it stays in biz 20 yrs. I find it reasonable to assume someone with multi state branches has a large volume of customers, meaning greater number of installs and problems. The more installs you have the more >exposure you have to breakdowns or dissatisfaction. It's a rule of numbers.

It's what I would have thought. I was shocked at what happened. I thought he was an established, solid business. Jay Egg was also a very nice and personable guy. I guess if it's a rule of numbers and when cash flow gets short it's ok to burn a little guy like me, then yeah, you're right. I don't know what to make of the post on www.ripoffreport.com: "Beware of this company as a potential employee and customer. They owe my husband six weeks of pay and have yet to pay!!!! He is one of may employees that were lied to, strung along for weeks and still have not been paid. They also are renowned for lying to customers. When they were unable to go to job sites, they tell the customers lies. They are not financially stable and use deposits paid by new customers to cover the expenses of other jobs. They do not use the money for that customer's equipment as the customer is led to believe. Please beware of this company, they talk a great talk, but can not deliver." I have no way to substantiate it's validity but it does describe my experience as a customer.

>4) If the money you owe the duct guy was greater than the down stroke then you were going to owe the plumber and driller anyway so you are piling on a little unless you were given the impression that 27K was the total.

No, my contract amount was for $54K. I'm grateful I ended up paying the well driller and plumber directly else they would have liens against my home as well. What I'm piling on is $27K that is a total loss for me because ultimately I'll have to pay the "duct guy" to clear the lien. In addition, I don't have anybody to honor the 20 year warranty that Egg included so all my service will be out of pocket.

>Multiple branches and lovely trappings and web sites are often the trappings of marketing (vs service) companies. While that doesn't mean market firms don't service their customers their focus is charge more to meet more to sell to more customers.

You're right. In the end I should have never gone with geothermal because the local companies with proven and verifiable service track records were all traditional HVAC companies. In my desire for a geothermal system, I placed too much trust in the web presence, magazine articles, college teaching appointments and published book. He was well marketed.

I'm really not expecting to recover my wasted money or resolve my problems painlessly. It's been over a year since I signed the contract with Egg and I'm still trying to get everything wrapped up. And I really don't have anything to contribute to the discussion about licensing, bonds, etc. I'll leave that up to all you professionals. But if I can save one person from entering into a bad contract with Egg it will be worth this posting.
joe.amiUser is Offline
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25 Aug 2012 08:10 PM
Very well said cgal. I think you have something to offer.
Have you discussed some sort of settlement with the sub?
Perhaps they would be willing to meet you in the middle and go after egg with you.
It still doesn't recoup everything, but gets it partway done.
Liens aren't enforced til sale or refi generally so if those are not on your immediate horizon you have a bargaining chip. A negotiation may also offer you a chance to get needed repairs done.
I wish you luck.
Joe Hardin
www.amicontracting.com
We Dig Comfort!
www.doityourselfgeothermal.com
Dig Your Own Comfort!
engineerUser is Offline
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25 Aug 2012 10:08 PM
Florida lien law works differently then some others. My understanding is that here a lienor has one year to enforce the lien, by foreclosing on the property.
Curt Kinder <br><br>

The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
joe.amiUser is Offline
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26 Aug 2012 10:22 AM
Hmmm. Well that gives us a year to negotiate.
How 'bout construction licensing folks. Do they have a body to intervene in this case?
Joe Hardin
www.amicontracting.com
We Dig Comfort!
www.doityourselfgeothermal.com
Dig Your Own Comfort!
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