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PatrickT
 Basic Member
 Posts:157
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| 12 Nov 2012 08:42 AM |
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Generally Spring and fall have larger temp swings from night to day. Our entire home is concrete so we can open the windows at night to cool the concrete to off set any warm days. So far we have not had to run the AC in the Spring or Fall.
Ideally, insulated shutters would be nice but with our glass being arches, not so easy.
Patrick T |
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 28 Nov 2012 02:48 AM |
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Late to the party... We have a suite of passive solar calculators on our website including an overhang design calculator. Please be sure to read the calculator instructions prior to use. http://www.borstengineeringconstruction.com/Calculators.html
*** Another test to see if opening this up by cliking the Edit button and then clicking the Submit button adds this sentence or creates a new post ***
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 28 Nov 2012 10:28 AM |
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We have a suite of passive solar calculators on our website including Have you designed any buildings in which passive solar supplies 100% of the heating needs? |
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 02 Dec 2012 10:27 AM |
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Yes and No, the answer really depending on the duration and frequency of sunny days, and the design economics.
Yes for a sunny day. This can easily be designed and accomplished using only pure passive solar and thermal mass.
Yes for a location that reliably has at least one sunny day every other day. This can be easily designed and accomplished with an integrated passive solar system and radiant hydronic heating system. The passive solar system collects excess heat in thermal mass and the radiant hydronic heating system moves and stores this excess heat until it is needed the following sunless day. So 100% of the heating needs can be accomplished, but this is not true passive solar and a small amount of electrical power is used for hydronic pumping.
It is also possible to design this integrated system with increased heat collection and storage capacity so as to handle multiple sunless days, however, the economics do not work out to make this a very attractive solution except for perhaps remote offgrid buildings. This would be similar to active photovoltaic electrical power system where you have to increase the size of your panels and your battery storage capacity so as to handle multiple sunless days. |
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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jonr
 Senior Member
 Posts:5341
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| 02 Dec 2012 11:12 AM |
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I second the thought about using trees on the east and west sides. |
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 02 Dec 2012 02:42 PM |
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Yes, trees on the east and west sides are always good. You should also minimize windows on the east and west sides to minimize heat losses too. Decidious trees on the south side may even be beneficial as well, as long as their solar obstruction effect (both with and without leaves at mature size) is included in the passive solar heat gain analysis. Decidious trees often sprout leaves just when you need shade and often lose their leaves just when you need sun in tune with the local climate...sort of like a well designed passive solar roof overhang. |
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 02 Dec 2012 11:50 PM |
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Yes for a sunny day I think when the statement "100% of the heating needs" is used, it generally refers to a time period of an entire year. Many homes can go through a sunny day cycle without additional heat input. In fact, my Pacific NorthWest home is designed to go just about two days, particularly during the shoulder season when lows are above freezing. Preliminary indications are that we have been successful with that. I am curious about how you are collecting that "excess heat" from the thermal mass and storing it in the radiant hydronic system for use later. Have you got a website on that home, or a description of the as built system and location? |
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jonr
 Senior Member
 Posts:5341
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| 03 Dec 2012 10:57 AM |
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I would consider a heat pump to move excess heat from a passive solar home to a storage tank. Of course this makes it no longer passive and at that point, a traditional active solar panel system may make more sense. |
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 03 Dec 2012 11:03 AM |
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Hello ICFHybrid. Yes, 100% always means 100% of the annual heating needs. As described previously, to achieve 100% with PURE passive solar (i.e., using ONLY irradiance, a fixed roof overhang design, and a thermal mass design that is NOT augmented with any other electrical/mechanical system), you need to be in a location that receives irradiance on a dependable and frequent basis. To achieve 100% you often have to get aggressive with solar fenestration area. Yes, there are locations where this design objective is realizable, however, you typically then also have to address the potential of overheating the building in the fall and spring months. A proper thermal mass design can certainly help mitigate this overheating issue, as well as give you some heat storage capacity to go perhaps a day or so without irradiance. Nevertheless, you are still always at risk of having a week or more without any significant irradiance. In the western portions of the PNW, you will routinely have multiple weeks without any significant irradiance. As such and because building codes also require it, you will also need to have an additional heating system to backup the passive solar. As described previously, if your backup system is a hydronic radiant floor heating system that has also been properly integrated with your passive solar design, you can utilize the hydronic radiant floor heating system controller and pumping elements to significantly extend your passive solar heating performance and to also address the potential overheating issue too. Much of this is explained in our DIY calculator instructions on our website. Heat storage is currently accomplished via insulated underground concrete water tanks although we have been field testing another technical approach. Heat rejection (used in fall, summer and spring months) is normally accomplished via earth ground heat transfer, but we have also done this in conjunction with water work projects (with controller addressing floor climatic dew point issue). Our company has only been in business since 2010 (currently based in Seattle area) and our initial efforts have largely been associated with the integrated system engineering design and controller design. We are in the process of relocating our company headquarters to southern OR (which is a passive solar meca of sorts) where we intend to expand our residential and light commercial construction service efforts. We have recently been considering adding a Gallery section to our website as well so please stay tuned...
www.BorstEngineeringConstruction.com
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 08 Dec 2012 11:27 AM |
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It would appear this forum is broken or has a bug. Cliking the Edit button on a previous post now creates a brand new post. My goal was only to edit a previous post to create a hot link where there was previously a cold URL. There should also be functionality to allow a poster to delete a previous post...e.g., to clean up the mess I just made... |
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 08 Dec 2012 12:13 PM |
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It only creates a new post if you then click the 'SUBMIT' button. |
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 08 Dec 2012 05:19 PM |
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Thanks ICFHybrid, however, I am still not understanding how to properly edit an existing post? I clicked the "Edit" button, made the change, and there was/is no way to save the change without clicking the "Submit" button. What is strange is that I did this very procedure on another post earlier today and it worked perfectly fine. However, when I did this procedure on this post, it created another separate post. Is there some "Save" button that I am not seeing or is there perhaps some time limit after which a new post is created in lieu of just revising the existing post? Other forums also have a "Delete" button so if you really mess up, you delete your post and start over. Sorry about asking so many questions and not asking them in the best place to ask them either... |
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 10 Dec 2012 06:06 PM |
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I don't know about a time limit on posts reopened for editing. I usually get them closed in a few minutes. The 'SUBMIT' button should not create a new post. Maybe it was a fluke or something.
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sailawayrb
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2283

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| 10 Dec 2012 06:29 PM |
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Posted By sailawayrb on 28 Nov 2012 02:48 AM Late to the party... We have a suite of passive solar calculators on our website including an overhang design calculator. Please be sure to read the calculator instructions prior to use.
http://www.borstengineeringconstruction.com/Calculators.html
*** Test to see if opening this up via Edit button and then clicking Submit add this sentence or creates a new post ***
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| Borst Engineering & Construction LLC - Competence, Integrity and Professionalism are integral to all that we do! |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 14 Dec 2012 08:35 AM |
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The formatting on the above post indicates that you are hitting the 'Quote' button, not the 'Edit' button. That will create a new post when you SUBMIT it.
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jel11698
 New Member
 Posts:1
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| 22 Feb 2013 03:25 PM |
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I designed my home as passive with 22% area of the south side wall with windows, 4% north, east, and west. I calculated the sun angle with basic trigonometry with the angle of the sun and height of eave to calculate the needed overhang. Through our first year we rarely need to use supplemental heat. In the summer we stil have light on the south side with no direct sun. To handle the equinox I added insulated shades inside the windows which fairly well controls the heat. However, I also built my own solar collector for hot water which is used for hydronic in-floor (slab) heating. At a latitude of 36 degrees out worst heating bill has been $42. My last standard built home was averaging $230/month in the winter months. |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 22 Feb 2013 07:43 PM |
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Do you have some drawings of that solar tie-in that you can share with us? Or a description? |
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JohnCubed
 New Member
 Posts:3
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| 19 Jun 2013 07:08 PM |
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I've noticed that same thing as the original poster. Overhangs on the south have little to no effect in shading the wall/window during the summer. My solution, and this goes against conventional wisdom, is to use vertical fins on the south walls and overhangs on the east and west walls. This seems to be providing more shading than the conventional way. |
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ICFHybrid
 Veteran Member
 Posts:3039
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| 19 Jun 2013 07:27 PM |
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What latitude are you? Does your "South" actually face South and how have you determined that? |
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JohnCubed
 New Member
 Posts:3
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| 19 Jun 2013 09:41 PM |
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The project is in San Francisco,CA. Latitude is 37.784410N. Project south is 8.8 degrees west of true south. |
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