I'm considering the wall panel system made by Kama-eebs of Las Vegas. Anyone have any experience with it?

I was just checking out their product review: http://k-tect.com/downloads/kamaproductoverview.pdf

I like this product, and actually didn't know it existed till this thread. I don't really have any other products to compare too, however on paper it looks great. Quite a few non-company related blog posts seem to give it some high reviews.

I'd be worried about the conduction thru the steel.

Am also thinking on using this product for new construction here in Alaska. Was first introduced to Kama Eebs via The Green Dream" an ongoing feature of a green build house (his) by one of the authors, Popular Science. he had some issues with panels not being exact - which they of course need to be since steel is the framing structure. This was Kama's first big build with the product, and they made it work. I contacted them. Very nice, really helpful in getting me product info, answering my questions re: cold weather suitability (great.) In fact, I spoke with a man who family lives 30 miles way in now Palin famous Wasilla. Then I posted on the Pop Sci forum regarding the house - and the designer emailed me back re: Kama, he, also from Alaska. So, I hope to report use with this product. It certainly sounds like a fabulous product. Hmm. Can't seem to link the PopSci link. Be sure and check out the video John the owner posted- showing the walls going up.

I have visited their plant in Vegas. Nice people, indeed. Ken is very prompt and helpful. I like a lot about the product. I wish there were more people out there with real-world experience with it.

I am familiar with the product.  This was not kama's first big project.  They have had many large successful projects.  The panel issues were due to the fabricator kama had on the east coast.   Of course, they are no longer a kama fabricator.  We are building in Canada.

Posted By smartwall on 08 Apr 2010 07:41 AM
I'd be worried about the conduction thru the steel.

The studs don't extend fully through the EPS- it's thermally broken at the core of the wall.  There's a pretty-good picture of it on p.2 here.

It appears acceptable.  However, I tend to lean on the side of caution with new building products.

I really like the product, America must turm to using more
Super Insulated building methods.

http://StyroHomeNEWS.blogspot.com

At 9000' and 9000 degree days, I've looked at a number of building systems to end up with an efficient house.  A number of reasons led to my decision to use Kama:

  1: Super insulation of course.  easy enough to get 30-40 R value, plus a tight build.


   I plan on doing as much of the construction as I can myself.  It'll be the third house I've built, and the largest and I'm not getting any younger.  Thus:

   2:  The weight advantage compared to standard SIPS will make it easier to raise.

   3:  The panels can be prefabbed at the factory like a SIP.  Cost of an 8" thick panel with fabrication is less than $8/ft, ex-works, when I checked last fall.

   4: I was concerned with soundproofing as I'll be within 100 feet of a couple of snowmakers.  I had read too many negatives about SIPS in that regard.  I am assuming that because there will not be a solid membrane attached like on a SIP, sound transmission will be much lower.

   5:  Looked hard at ICF's both EPS and composite.  I will still probably use ICF for the below grade walls, but will need experienced hands for the pour.  

   6:  I can't see where one can get the Rvalues in an ICF that one can with a SIP or Kama system.  Comparing inches of foam, SIPS/Kama have significantly more.  In cold climates, the mass effect of an ICF doesn't help (ORNL data).

All this does not mean I don't like SIPS/ICF's.  They are great technologies and have their own advantages.  I've just decided that Kama will be cost effective, easier to handle, go up quickly like a SIP, be quiet and above all be efficient.

Now to get plans finished, retire  and start building.  Just a couple more years.


   

LarryT;

its a nice wall system but at $8. not economical given you still need to sheath the walls, I did not care for the wood trusses on a steel wall system

I tried to locate the paper " In cold climates, the mass effect of an ICF doesn't help (ORNL data)" can someone post a link to it?

John

$8/ft is in the same ballpark as the material cost for an ICF system. You still may need to sheath that as well. Regarding a comparison to SIPS (already sheathed) I don't plan on sheathing the KAMA. There's no need to with KAMA as far as I can see. Stucco directly over it if you want, apply stone to it, Hardiplank over it like you would a conventional system. Treat it like you normally would regular stick construction. Just happens to be steel studs and one heck of a lot of foam and great air tightness like a sip or ICF. Bracing can be done through diagonal steel. Regarding wood trusses on a steel wall? Is there an issue I haven't heard of? Steel framing is pretty common and it's generally paired with wood members at some point. If not the roof, then the floor. Not knocking any other system, but there are many ways to skin a cat, I was just offering the reasons for my choice here. I think the system has attributes that I consider good in my situation.

John I wish I could. It has been posted in the forums before, mostly around the discussion regarding R value of ICF's a year or so ago. The results indicated that the colder the climate zone, the less benefit is seen from thermal mass. At my location it was pretty small. I'll look in my office computer. I may have stored a link for it there, but it'll be a long shot

So how is this going for you LarryT. I'm trying to decide what is the best option for Midwest weather that is energy efficient and not too expensive too build. K-tect makes it seem simple enough that a do-it-yourself, build your own home person could do it. The only thing that concerns me is the lack of photos, testimonials from others who've built with k-tect, along with the real world results on efficiency and how people like it. A good note, though, is Project Frog has picked k-tect to build with.

have you every seen a SIP- structural insualted panel. Lots of manufactures. Most of them are clad in wood which ads to the strength. With metal studs I you would have a lot of thermal conductivity. I would say the wood SIP would perform better.

Posted By Roberth on 31 Oct 2011 08:32 PM
have you every seen a SIP- structural insualted panel. Lots of manufactures. Most of them are clad in wood which ads to the strength. With metal studs I you would have a lot of thermal conductivity. I would say the wood SIP would perform better.

Metal skin SIPs (not studs) dominate the market in commercial cold refrigeration, thru thermally broken channels out perform wood

There is no thermal conductivity with K-tect wall, floor and roof systems. That is the beauty of the product. No Thermal Bridge. K-tect out performs SIPS.

Yes, this is the part I like. What has become a grave concern, though, is my wife is quite worried that if there was ever a fire that we would kill over from fumes before we could ever make it out dd the house. How does k-tect approach this? It sounds dangerous when you think about that issue.

Update: After discussions with K-Tect, typical fiberglass insulation is much more toxic than their eps when it is burned. Further, the MBDC reports concerning Styropor, the eps that K-tect uses in their panel fabrication, states that their eps has received many "Green" certificates as an insulation and sound barrier.  It will not support a flame.  It will not burn by itself.  It does not emit harmful gases or voc's. It has been approved by the state of California for use in schools and public buildings.   Given that information, we plan on pricing out the cost of building using K- Tect in comparison to other alternatives mentioned in this forum, but I'm leaning to be hopeful with K-Tect.

I am not aware of this product and its quality .If anyone has information regarding to this please forward it to me also. Thanks