ICFconstruction
Veteran Member
Posts:1323
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21 Jan 2012 10:18 PM |
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We put control joints in flat-work, CMUs, stucco, EIFS and so on. Ever heard of control joints in ICF walls to allow for expansion and contraction? What happens because we don't? |
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Brad Kvanbek - ICFconstruction.net |
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ICFHybrid
Veteran Member
Posts:3039
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21 Jan 2012 10:40 PM |
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Control joints are to avoid unsightly cracking in cement slabs. The cracks still occur, they are just hidden by the joints. Since the ICF concrete is not visible, I don't think we care about the cracking.
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ICFconstruction
Veteran Member
Posts:1323
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22 Jan 2012 12:38 AM |
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Then I mean expansion joints. |
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Brad Kvanbek - ICFconstruction.net |
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ICFHybrid
Veteran Member
Posts:3039
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22 Jan 2012 01:23 AM |
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Pretty much the same function, particularly in residential construction. Residential concrete is not restrained enough to worry about expansion that would threaten its integrity. The other thing ICF walls don't see is temperature extremes like the ones that make expansion joints necessary other places. |
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James Patrick
New Member
Posts:8
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08 Feb 2012 05:14 PM |
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Concrete will shrink as it cures in ICF, I have read somewhere to have a control joint every 25-30' An easy method would be to insert 1/2" OSB strips from the top before pour??? |
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ICFHybrid
Veteran Member
Posts:3039
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08 Feb 2012 07:11 PM |
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What would be the point of the extra expense and effort? Maybe if you could find where you read about it needing control joints, we could see what the purpose would be. |
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James Patrick
New Member
Posts:8
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08 Feb 2012 07:57 PM |
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http://www.nrmca.org/aboutconcrete/cips/07p.pdf |
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greentree
Advanced Member
Posts:587
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08 Feb 2012 08:33 PM |
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Haha. Burn. From the NRMCA no less. |
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ICFconstruction
Veteran Member
Posts:1323
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08 Feb 2012 09:47 PM |
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It appears from that NRMA article that their idea is to control where the wall cracks, and then to water proof it with caulk. That is the only purpose I see from the article. |
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Brad Kvanbek - ICFconstruction.net |
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ICFHybrid
Veteran Member
Posts:3039
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08 Feb 2012 11:00 PM |
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Some people are easily influenced. Could this be a solution in search of a problem? There's not a word in the article about ICF. In fact, much of it is devoted to practices that might help prevent a conventional foundation wall from cracking due to temperature or hydration issues. Both of those are well-mediated by the insulating qualities of the ICF in the first place. As you might imagine, cosmetic cracks aren't going to be a problem with ICF walls because of the foam covering. I just poured a bunch of ICF walls with no "control joints" and a bunch of exposed retaining walls that did have some triangular rips nailed vertically to the face of the form. Once removed, these v-grooves are decorative and will NOT be filled with caulk. |
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Jerry D. Coombs, PE
Basic Member
Posts:138
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15 Feb 2012 02:45 PM |
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The article refers to T&S control joints. It would be a good idea, even in ICF, IF you have a run in excess of about 30 feet without a corner, AND you have a way of caulking the crack. The purpose of the control joint is to have one wide, straight crack that's easy to seal, than to have a whole bunch of narrower unsightly ones. Since with ICF, you can't see it, or caulk it, and they usually have a membrane when underground, the whole thing becomes moot. Forget about it. |
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Jerry D. Coombs, P.E.<br>Coombs Engineering, P.C.<br>
<br>You can have with quality; You can have it fast; You can have it cheap. Pick any two. |
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