Mgo board WARNING!!!
Last Post 14 Dec 2016 10:25 AM by Innova. 34 Replies.
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messiUser is Offline
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05 Nov 2010 03:09 AM
hello evrybody
 i'm sorry about my english
 evryone dont tuch this material!!! i bought mgo china, for interior walls, and this board always suprise me to bad, i gone replace all my home to gypsum!!
the first problem- the mgo not stick to light steel construction by screws!
the mgo leak out chlor that cause corozia eat the screws and the construction and its harmful chemical!
after i paint the wall 4 times ( with 4 differnt method) apear cracks in the connection of boards and the putty fall down!
the mgo cause me big economic damage and i reccomend all of you dont fall down with that material like me
Messi


chrispsevdasUser is Offline
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07 Nov 2010 05:46 AM
Hello there,
I am from Cyprus, a relativly hot country and i have the same problem with the joints of mgo boardsWhere are u from?)! Whatever method i use, i have cacks.The paradox of the situation is that, I dont get cracks evrywhere.....same materials under the same conditions with the same joining technic, either crack or not!I cannot explain it.The only thing tha i can gueess is that the mgo boards i have are not exactly the same with the same characteristics even though i bought them together from the same supplier.Are there different kind of mgo boards with diferent charasteristics?


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07 Nov 2010 07:03 AM
What product did you us as joint filler and what tape did you use? These can make a real difference and did you apply thin coats or just plaster it on in 1/4" layers?


R.J. Fergie Fergusson
messiUser is Offline
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07 Nov 2010 07:14 AM
its my major worry!! the boards non same wheight also!!

in my last try i paint priemre x (the most stronger preimere in my country) then acrilic glue with net , then the most expensive putty in my country, then primere x again then paint! after week the crack apear again, this material DISASTER!!


FergieUser is Offline
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07 Nov 2010 07:23 AM
My question was asked as some taping compounds have adhesives in them and others do not, expense is not an indicator of this! As well fibre mesh tapes some are self bonding and others are not, I myself do not use mesh type tapes only paper set in a proper jointing compound not a topping compound.
If compounds are built up to much the top drys quicker than the lower and will crack as the lower need to expel the liquid, thin coats are the preferred method rather than slapping it on trying to hurry the job especially in hotter climates.


R.J. Fergie Fergusson
lovestobuildUser is Offline
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09 Nov 2010 02:36 PM
China has developed a reputation for manufacturing substandard products of all kinds.Their lack of environmental responsibility and cheap wages have caused legitimate companies all over the planet to close down.If you support Chinese products,in my opinion you deserve any problems that come with.


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09 Nov 2010 09:01 PM
Posted By lovestobuild on 09 Nov 2010 02:36 PM
...If you support Chinese products...

These days, what other kinds of products are there?


messiUser is Offline
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10 Nov 2010 12:20 AM
maybe you right, i just warning all friends here


ChristineUser is Offline
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10 Nov 2010 01:07 AM
Actually there are different classes of mgo board in China. If you buy the cheap board, then definitely there will be a problem.

It's quite normal that buyers will send inquiry to lots of suppliers and selete the economic one to work with because they only consider price but not quality. Now the price of high class mgo board in China is about 50% higher than the cleaper one.

Anyway, mgo board is not that bad as your image. It depends on what kind of mgo board you use in your project.

Best Regards.
Christine
Direct Phone: 0086 592 5789079


TorbenUser is Offline
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10 Nov 2010 01:31 AM
Christine,

You forgot to add that you are a MgO board manufacturer on this post. I'm sure it was just a minor oversight.


FergieUser is Offline
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10 Nov 2010 01:41 AM
One issue with a Chinese products is regulations as to quality! In most cases there are none and as such it is always buyer be ware! They are starting to make gains in this regard but it will take years for it to make a real difference. I do hope they will do it quickly but I shall not hold my breath.


R.J. Fergie Fergusson
ChristineUser is Offline
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10 Nov 2010 03:21 AM
Hello Torben,

Yes, we are a manufacturer of mgo board in China, but this product is not all as bad as what you suffer now. There are still some good among them. Like human being, some is good and some is bad. It depends on which one you meet.


cmkavalaUser is Offline
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11 Nov 2010 07:26 AM
christine;

how does the consumer determine which MGO is good and which one is bad?


Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br />
icemanUser is Offline
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07 Dec 2010 03:59 AM
I agree, there are many classes of MGO board and the jury is still out to which
is the best board, manufacturer and supplier for a variety or reasons.

But , there are some very good products / boards that can be obtained and are
suitable for most types of end users applications and the quality and durabilty
has generally improved markedly over the last 3 years or so.

As the product is relatively new and the composition so different to what has been
so widely used in the past particular attention to the other matching compontants
needs to be given serious consideration to ensure all is compatable.
.
It is fair to say though that of the many , many manufacturers in China there are
only a few that can and are willing to adapt to the overseas stringent requirements.

In essence they dont have an understanding of the conditions that are applicable
outside their own country and perhaps dont really care.

Price is and will always be an issue when purchases are being considered and just
because one is either the cheapest or alternatively the most expensive does not
guarantee a good product or in fact good supplier and good service.

The most lacking from China suppliers we have found is they are not willing to admit
a problem may or does exsist and remedy the loss and have no idea of the real costs
bourne by the buyer of unsuitable products.  
Again , maybe they just dont care once sold..

But , its still a product worth the time and effort to explore its advantages.



icemanUser is Offline
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07 Dec 2010 04:09 AM
Its not all bad.
There are some very good manufacturers which have good products.

But ,its a major event to find them , and then get them to adhere to the standards.

The communication process and understanding of the properties of the product that
is a issue that needs time and effort.

For them,  its all about orders and not much else.


bbobUser is Offline
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06 Jan 2011 06:35 AM
The Problem with china many times is that you don't know if you are really dealing with the manufacturer or a man in the middle.

Hence there are even programs that show how important customers going to china a fooled. The so called manufacturer rents an office has some people doing someting, some products where people are working on and you get the impression you are dealing with a legit company.

Check stuff on www.alibaba.com and you see manuy companies all offering the same products, but who is the manufacturer ?
The next problem is that sure there might be differenc ein quality but it's common that when you ask for a sample you get a good quality and you open the container and oeps different quality.
since you pay upfront, try to get your money back.
Than you can pay someone to inspect the good before they leave, and sure the seller might pay this person more. This means you have to go there yourself and check the container.

But sure there are some good companies that do make quality but the problem is that it's difficult to tell if you are really dealing with a good company or not. Unfortunatly the mentality of many chineese companies is only selling selling containers, tkae cash upfront and solving problems, mmm never heard of of they say we fix next time.


TorbenUser is Offline
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06 Jan 2011 11:22 AM
I've never imported from China but done lots of export to China. Everything we shipped was against a letter of credit (LC) that required the goods to be received in good condition before we would actually receive payment (break the LC). It surprises me this not being done when goods are going in the other direction. I would never expect a good outcome buying from China, money up front with no recourse.


cmkavalaUser is Offline
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07 Jan 2011 09:41 PM
Torben;

I don't think the receiving of the material is the issue, it is like the case of chinese drywall, it looks OK, but you don't know there is a problem with the material until several months after it is installed .



Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br />
WMGERUser is Offline
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04 Mar 2011 12:00 AM
Hi everyone, if you want to know more of MGO board, you can go to wconline website to read the artical written by Mr. Robert Thomas, who is USA nationally recognized EIFS consultant. http://www.wconline.com/CDA/Archive/BNP_GUID_9-5-2006_A_10000000000000194720 , the biggest manufacturer and distrubiter is in USA for MGO board, till now before we can have chance to have better construction materials that MGO board is the best one.

MGO board has so many characters and advantage that other construction materisl that cannot exceed. if you buy the MGO board from USA local shops in good reputation not in cheap price and you get the right installation instruction from them then you will have no problem.


brainUser is Offline
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25 Mar 2011 11:09 PM
Is there a guide on the cost comparison? I am looking at PUR SIP panels, and I'm not finding a lot of PUR MgO options.


ComoUser is Offline
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27 Mar 2011 02:02 AM
earthcoresips.com

Not a big price difference.


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21 Mar 2016 08:18 AM
Posted By chinsunboard on 21 Mar 2016 12:38 AM
we could supply high quality Mgo Board, it is called Magensium sulfate board , it will be no sweating , no beige , when you put the board in the moisture, the board will not change the color, not change to yellow color with water . You could try our samples , if you need .


MGO/MGCL PRODUCTS ARE NON-COMPLIANT FOR INTERIORS MgO/MgCl interior products (used primarily for interior tile underlayment) are governed by the International Code Council – Evaluation Services (ICC-ES) Acceptance Criteria 386 (AC 386). To date, no product made with MgO or MgCl has been tested to AC 386 and, consequently, no ICC-ES report has been issued. And, even if MgO/MgCl backer boards were tested to AC 386, AC 386 does not allow for the product to be installed in wet areas, as defi ned by the IBC. Therefore, currently available MgO/MgCl backer boards are not code approved.


Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br />
YunionBoardUser is Offline
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13 May 2016 12:29 AM
Posted By cmkavala on 21 Mar 2016 08:18 AM
Posted By chinsunboard on 21 Mar 2016 12:38 AM
we could supply high quality Mgo Board, it is called Magensium sulfate board , it will be no sweating , no beige , when you put the board in the moisture, the board will not change the color, not change to yellow color with water . You could try our samples , if you need .


MGO/MGCL PRODUCTS ARE NON-COMPLIANT FOR INTERIORS MgO/MgCl interior products (used primarily for interior tile underlayment) are governed by the International Code Council – Evaluation Services (ICC-ES) Acceptance Criteria 386 (AC 386). To date, no product made with MgO or MgCl has been tested to AC 386 and, consequently, no ICC-ES report has been issued. And, even if MgO/MgCl backer boards were tested to AC 386, AC 386 does not allow for the product to be installed in wet areas, as defi ned by the IBC. Therefore, currently available MgO/MgCl backer boards are not code approved.


Sulfate mgo board is not MGO/MGCL product, there is no MGCL in sulfate mgo board, should be a new product named MGO/MgSO4 product


Live Green With Yunion<br />
www.yunionboard.com<br />
manufacturer of <A href="http://www.yunionboard.com/product/mgo-board">mgo panels</A>, <A href="http://www.yunionboard.com/product/chloride-free-mgo-board">chloride free mgo board</A>, <A href="http://www.yunionboard.com/product/fiber-cement-panels">fiber cement panels</A>, and <A href="http://www.yunionboard.com/product/calcium-silicate-board">calcium silicate board</A>
InnovaUser is Offline
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11 Aug 2016 11:01 AM
Properly manufactured MGO Boards will have a moisture level below below 12% and they can be taped and finished similar to drywall. The attached images depict MGO SIPs taped, finished and painted interior and exterior MGO SIP panels. Innova Eco Building System located in Miami Florida supplies accredited MGO Board and product approved MGO SIP panels. We have been manufacturing product approved MGO SIPs for more than five years and have manufactured more than 300 MGO SIP homes to date. Build the Home of the Future Today, with InnovaPanels, Patented MGO SIPs available for your next project. javascript:amaf_insertHTML('');amaf_toggleInline(5661,24560,0); javascript:amaf_insertHTML('');amaf_toggleInline(5662,24560,0);

Attachment: Tape-and-Finsih-web.jpg
Attachment: MGO-SIP-Homes.jpg

Mags888User is Offline
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02 Dec 2016 02:32 PM
Most of you are correct on the Chinese made MgO board companies. There is no way I would deal directly with a Chinese manufacturing company of MgO building materials. I've been working with various people/companies and MgO manufacturing plants here in the states for the last several years. I can guarantee I have found the best of the best regarding MgO building systems, SIPS, SIS panels and plain old MgO building wall systems in the US. Any of you are welcome to call me as we are getting ready to kick off a major "Green" Building Initiative here in GA using these above-mentioned products. As a matter of fact, an entire city is about to launch in FL using these amazing, healthy and sustainable materials that are water/mold, bug/termite proof, 2-hour fire rated, hurricane resistant, will save no less than 40-50% in energy costs along with having a 20-year warranty. How would you like to own a home like this? We also have funding available for large Green Building initiatives. Here's to all of our sustainability efforts.

For additional information call Maggie Steck, Alternate Energy Solutions - 678-908-7095 P.S. We are partnered with the DOE and EPA along with all the necessary certifications.


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06 Dec 2016 10:09 AM
MAGS888: "I've been working with various people/companies and MgO manufacturing plants here in the states for the last several years".

What board manufactures in the US? "working with" In what capacity?

The only MGO board mfg. in the US is Foreverboard, NY, raw light burnt MAG from Premier, all others are manufactured or mined in China. Disregard all efforts to standardize out of control China and pass that cost to US consumers unless it includes comprehensive testing as denoted in the lab test below and constant monitoring which drives cost up to high, or a patent exist. When you shop for any MGO board look for a lab tested patent on the issues with leaching and fastener corrosion as Premier has attached. If you want to risk this product, and there are risk, look for such a test and ask to speak to the chemist that conducted the testing. Verify that chemist degree, how long they have been working with MGO board mfg, proof of successful install in your climate zone, where the raw materials is mined, who spot checks the manufacture. If you read this patent and you don't understand the bulk if it hire someone that can explain or ask the chemist. Anything less is unfounded sales hype! If a mfg was that confident they warranty should reflect that by clearly stating they accept all damages from product defects as in the OP for at least 25 years, including any punitive damages such as builder reputation, rentals, mold/rot, etc, that should not exist in China if you are not there, some in the USA have dropped out of business so deal with someone that has proven success here in the USA for at least 25 yrs.....You should also find paint testing in the report and a list of approved paints, call and ask those mfg if they warranty their products on MGO. There are 1000s of grades and additives, no general rules of thumb like most building designs.

https://www.google.com/patents/US8603237

MGO in the raw has been around for centuries, has excellent properties, when made into a board if not done right can cause major costly issues. Another option is a plaster you hire a reputable chemist to help with. GP Dense Armor PLUS and ThermalCore PCM boards are options.

Building a city in Fl where most China MGO is imported does not guarantee it's success in every US climate zone, don't be fooled, also the DOE and EPA won't pay for damages, read that one carefully, we lack US empirical data, dynamic testing standards.

These are the things that happens often when DIYs get internet/other bad advice or get into things better left to a pro. Now they pay the price.


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06 Dec 2016 11:44 AM
This statement is not true. There are at least three MGO manufactures with ICC acceptance criteria for their board, we have been using one of them for the past 5 years and also have Florida Product approvals.


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06 Dec 2016 11:59 AM
I have talked to ForeverBoard and right now, they only manufacture interior MGO board for use as a drywall replacement. They do not have approvals nor are they manufacturing a exterior structural sheathing at this time. The boards we use are exterior rated structural boards that are free from all of the issues described in your comments. The board we use is fully tested here in the USA and product approved. The board we use is also patented and fully insured against defects. We do not know of another MGO manufacturer offering product liability insurance for their products here in the USA. The board we use also is the only board that we have seen to date with a stable 10 - 12% moisture content. The only issue keeping exterior grade structural MGO sheathing from being made in the USA is current market demand. The current demand for MGO board in the USA is not yet at a level to support a major domestic MGO manufacturing facility. Many will argue this, but the real cost associated with setting up an automated first class manufacturing facility that can produce a quality product and meet the needs of the market is more than $20 million. I would guess that there will be more than one domestic MGO manufacturing facility in the USA within the next 3 to five years if not sooner. There are too many groups working hard on this for it not to occur sooner, rather than later.


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06 Dec 2016 12:17 PM
Who is making US MGO board buying US mined MAG? The MAG is key, lite vs dead. I don't know what you said was not true in my last post I never referred to ICC I don't need to get a permit....it won't assure a good design or product liability. Product warranty insurance? Please post it here so I can comment. I read alot of them, Dragon, Jet, all had ways out in the fine print.

I know big players are getting behind this with big money, let them work the bugs out, homeowners as this OP warned stay away in the meantime don't do these mfgs field and protoype testing. These mfg need to fund there own specs in any climate zones they wish to sell, do some testing at least a full year of weather, different common paints & fasteners....publish test results..We all hate insurance and/or warranted claims don't go there. I have seen NOTHING posted as Premiers patent to begin to prove otherwise. Post it too, I understand them :)


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06 Dec 2016 12:27 PM
Thank you for highlighting these very real and potential hazards as well as the importance for diligent and independent spot checks. Proper formulation and monitoring is critical. Chloride in traditional MgO is the culprit and if not properly eliminated can cause corrosion of metal fasteners and flashing. In addition, chloride leaching can also cause calcification of the front surface which makes the boards non-permeable thereby trapping moisture inside the wall cavities and creating an environment rich for mold growth. Agreed, a responsible company will address these items. The advantage of a properly formulated magnesium board over gypsum products is the magnesium boards require no protective coating (like fiberglass mat), don’t crumble or weaken when exposed to moisture, are non-combustible and far more durable. Thank you for your post!


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06 Dec 2016 01:09 PM
You did not answer my question as to what us mfg you are working with and in what capacity. I've been part of mfg qual testing and know the lies well, in multi-million dollar labs developing materials properties. What should come of of them when it occurs is hot box testing, thermal/temp/moisture or simulated climate zone pre- fatigue testing with the board, paints, fasteners, reinforcements, etc, over some standard accelerated life cycle then back calibrated by actual field testing......My guess that will be a costly commercially funded mfg project by those wanting to know that trickles down to residential not the other way around.

There is a whole lot more to the desired properties than leaching, corrosion, portland cement concretes or gypsum binder, lime binder concretes, can do that or whether or not they need a high perm breathable FG scrim mesh.

"non-permeable thereby trapping moisture inside the wall cavities and creating an environment rich for mold growth."

People do this all the time will all kinds products that don't know any better.


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06 Dec 2016 05:19 PM
What is the moisture content of the board you are trying to paint?


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07 Dec 2016 08:43 AM
You seem to think MC( Max Moisture Content) is the only property that matters when it comes to a paint binders adhesion. The mechanical property we are referring to is lap shear and tensile strengths and they are measurable by stress/strain gages. The same properties are sometimes published by glue, adhesives, paints, by some mfgs, the better ones. They should be part of the life cyclic testing I referred to above and published. Domestic QA indi verification spot checks s/b part of mfg qualifications. Regardless of MC, not all paint binders are created equal. Mineral silicates for example get stronger as they recure and are best installed wet. Besides all that there are chemical requirements.

In my mind another critical property PI(plastic index) or the difference between the surface of the MAG board and paints needs to be close to same to reduce cracking. Once cracks develops it makes it easier to leach or infiltrate moisture that promotes it.  Other properties would be strength-to weight China mag is lower than premier, and constant density composition.

"non-permeable thereby trapping moisture inside the wall cavities and creating an environment rich for mold growth."

What was being discussed here I don't think you followed is vapor lock a high MC would make worse.

You mag mfgs seem to be trying anything you can to promote MAG when the proper testing and documentations are not available to include a full lab test report or patent as Premier has, along with some hot box testing that simulates different boundary conditions with the specific grade and composition including paints, fasteners, reinforcements. Several material properties should result test prototype builds verify. I can guarantee the funding at residential is not there. Until then be warned as the OP is correct.


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09 Dec 2016 10:19 AM
I was looking at up coming WUFI add ons and noticed,

Corrosion of metals exposed to concrete, stucco, and other natural, mineral-based building materials

MAG would fall in mineral-based. That should help Moisture Resistant Design Professionals.

https://wufi.de/en/software/wufi-add-ons/


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14 Dec 2016 10:25 AM
MGO Board that has been manufactured properly with a proper moisture content below 12% can be painted with exterior grade paint. MGO is a wonderful product if you purchase an approved board. Purchasing low cost MGO board from unknown manufactures on Alibaba is asking for problems. A quality 12mm exterior structural grade MGO board with shipping will cost you close to $30 a board for 4 x 8' sheets. Purchase quality board from manufactures with updated testing and quality control reports and you will not have a problem. javascript:amaf_insertHTML('');amaf_toggleInline(5789,24560,0);

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