Hola, I am a chilean guy who for heritage has a terrain, kind of big, I rent it to a local organism, let´s say a municipality and make some money but when the contract expires I´ll have to build something and SIP is getting popular here but I don´t know much about his resistance against earthquakes or tremors...in most other fields I can see they are a good option to traditional building. I lived in Canada for a year but I don´t remember see them..

What type of SIP is getting popular there in Chile?

Posted By Jelly on 22 Oct 2014 10:13 AM
What type of SIP is getting popular there in Chile?

Jelly,
(http://www.construtec.cl/ )a Chilean based construction company uses 26 ga./ white skins with EPS cores to build schools and clinics, their claim to fame is their ability to produce new buildings on campuses during the 3 month summer vacation, in most cases they leave the painted white skins as the exterior and interior wall finish , even in rooms used for surgery.

I haven't found much data for it in seismic areas, but one would assume that a monocoque would perform well.

I also think it would perform well. Concrete cracks under tension - steel and foam bend, give and do less damage if they do fall down.

Is glue + screws ever used with steel SIPs? I would think that it would be stronger than just the point loads created with screws.

Posted By cmkavala on 24 Oct 2014 03:34 PM

a Chilean based construction company uses 26 ga./ white skins with EPS cores to build schools and clinics, their claim to fame is their ability to produce new buildings on campuses during the 3 month summer vacation, in most cases they leave the painted white skins as the exterior and interior wall finish , even in rooms used for surgery.

I guess the building codes in Chile are very lax because an exposed SIP without a fire/thermal barrier would not pass code here in the states. Without drywall the exposed skin would fail fairly quickly in a fire since EPS melts at 180F. I would guesstimate within a minute or two the SIP would de-laminate from the skin and fail.

Supposedly one can apply intumescent "paint" to meet a 15 min thermal barrier requirement, but I have no idea how practical this is. In the case of a fire, the coating will bubble (like a foam) and reduce heat transfer.

Posted By jonr on 25 Oct 2014 02:21 PM
Supposedly one can apply intumescent "paint" to meet a 15 min thermal barrier requirement, but I have no idea how practical this is. In the case of a fire, the coating will bubble (like a foam) and reduce heat transfer.

No building department here in the USA would OK such a product. I sure wouldn't want to be the building occupant in that build-up.

Intumescent coating are often approved in the USA as thermal barriers over spray foams. Over steel + EPS, I don't know - probably if someone bothered to test the assembly per requirements.

Posted By jonr on 25 Oct 2014 05:49 PM
Intumescent coating are often approved in the USA as thermal barriers over spray foams. Over steel + EPS, I don't know - probably if someone bothered to test the assembly per requirements.

Yes it is allowed by code

Posted By Lbear on 25 Oct 2014 04:11 PM

Posted By jonr on 25 Oct 2014 02:21 PM
Supposedly one can apply intumescent "paint" to meet a 15 min thermal barrier requirement, but I have no idea how practical this is. In the case of a fire, the coating will bubble (like a foam) and reduce heat transfer.

No building department here in the USA would OK such a product. I sure wouldn't want to be the building occupant in that build-up.

All building departments should allow it because it meets the requirement, I cannot thing of any reason they would not

Posted By jonr on 25 Oct 2014 11:45 AM
I also think it would perform well. Concrete cracks under tension - steel and foam bend, give and do less damage if they do fall down.

Is glue + screws ever used with steel SIPs? I would think that it would be stronger than just the point loads created with screws.

Actually the international United States code does allow for no thermal barrier under certain conditions, I think the Chilean's are using common sense knowing that steel does not burn or ignite,
the old argument that the panel would delaminate at 180 degrees is ridiculous statement , to get to 180 there is something else burning in the building to get the wall surface to that point , any occupants are long gone before that occurs from inhalation of toxic gasses or collapsed lungs, a catastrophic failure at that point would be the least of your worries

the old argument that the panel would delaminate at 180 degrees is ridiculous statement

Not to mention that I've poured 212F water into EPS cups and they held up just fine.

Posted By cmkavala on 25 Oct 2014 08:39 PM


All building departments should allow it because it meets the requirement, I cannot thing of any reason they would not

Chris, can you point me to the IBC that would allow such a build-up? My building department used the 2006 IBC and now they adopted the 2012 IBC and I was told that a steel SIP with EPS core requires a minimum of 1/2" of sheetrock/drywall in order to meet the 15-minute barrier in a residential application. Two layers of 5/8" drywall would be required for a commercial application but I am more concerned about the residential application.

This is the first I have heard of a "paint" that could be applied on a steel SIP with EPS core and pass code as a thermal barrier. Please direct me to the IBC where it allows that.

Posted By cmkavala on 25 Oct 2014 08:50 PM

I think the Chilean's are using common sense knowing that steel does not burn or ignite,
the old argument that the panel would delaminate at 180 degrees is ridiculous statement , to get to 180 there is something else burning in the building to get the wall surface to that point , any occupants are long gone before that occurs from inhalation of toxic gasses or collapsed lungs, a catastrophic failure at that point would be the least of your worries

Nobody here, including me, stated that steel burns. Steel can melt, deform and fail but even that was not brought up by anyone.

It's not the 26 gauge steel that is in question but the EPS core that is the essential key in what makes or breaks a SIP. EPS begins to soften at around 170 - 180F and that is not my opinion but what is stated on the SIP website itself:

Steel SIP - Long Term Service Temperature = 167F
Maximum Exposure Temperature = 180F

A steel SIP with an EPS core is held together with a thin layer of glue on both sides of the skin. If that glue bond fails, the skins delaminate and the SIP fails. At 180F the EPS begins to soften and shrink, melting and pulling away from the heat source.

I am not arguing against steel SIPs with EPS cores, I think it is a great option for certain builds. Is it a 100% fool-proof method of building? Of course not. It has its pros and cons like any other building methodology.

Posted By Lbear on 25 Oct 2014 10:55 PM

Posted By cmkavala on 25 Oct 2014 08:39 PM


All building departments should allow it because it meets the requirement, I cannot thing of any reason they would not

Chris, can you point me to the IBC that would allow such a build-up? My building department used the 2006 IBC and now they adopted the 2012 IBC and I was told that a steel SIP with EPS core requires a minimum of 1/2" of sheetrock/drywall in order to meet the 15-minute barrier in a residential application. Two layers of 5/8" drywall would be required for a commercial application but I am more concerned about the residential application.

This is the first I have heard of a "paint" that could be applied on a steel SIP with EPS core and pass code as a thermal barrier. Please direct me to the IBC where it allows that.

Posted By cmkavala on 25 Oct 2014 08:50 PM

I think the Chilean's are using common sense knowing that steel does not burn or ignite,
the old argument that the panel would delaminate at 180 degrees is ridiculous statement , to get to 180 there is something else burning in the building to get the wall surface to that point , any occupants are long gone before that occurs from inhalation of toxic gasses or collapsed lungs, a catastrophic failure at that point would be the least of your worries

Nobody here, including me, stated that steel burns. Steel can melt, deform and fail but even that was not brought up by anyone.

It's not the 26 gauge steel that is in question but the EPS core that is the essential key in what makes or breaks a SIP. EPS begins to soften at around 170 - 180F and that is not my opinion but what is stated on the SIP website itself:

Steel SIP - Long Term Service Temperature = 167F
Maximum Exposure Temperature = 180F

A steel SIP with an EPS core is held together with a thin layer of glue on both sides of the skin. If that glue bond fails, the skins delaminate and the SIP fails. At 180F the EPS begins to soften and shrink, melting and pulling away from the heat source.

I am not arguing against steel SIPs with EPS cores, I think it is a great option for certain builds. Is it a 100% fool-proof method of building? Of course not. It has its pros and cons like any other building methodology.

Lbear;
its not going to help you out in your residential application, however the IRC does exclude the "thermal barrier" in two areas R316.5.3 and R316.5.4 by using a minimum .016 base metal as an ingnition barrier, most steel skinned sips are .019
I guess the writers of the code don't think that fires ever occur in attics and crawl spaces?

US embassy (Guyana)using interior SIPs with no thermal barrier ................

US embassy with all 3" exterior walls, 3" interior partitions, 3" roof panels, 6" second floor - floor panels and 3" first floor - floor panels'