I pour both conventional and ICF's.
Over time I have found a very rough comparison that I use to go over my figures, before submitting a bid.

These are my keys.
1. Cost of concrete for 8 in conventional or 6 in core ICF is roughly the same.Lower vol ICF mix at a higher price equals regular wall mix pricing.
2. Cost of rebar for ICF is over and above conventional, which has very little by comparison.
3. Cost of ICF block is over and above conventional price.
4. ICF labor is higher than conventional but equals out, when the costs of trucking and handling forms is taken into account.
    Stripping labor is highly reduced in ICF's vs conventional.
5. Capital costs for bracing helps offset formwork capital, although, the investment ratio is low vs high for conventional.
6. This only applies to simple basements, 12 corners or less. Complexity adds to ICf bigtime. Less for conventional.
7. Assumed pump truck pour either wall.

Simplefied.
Competitive conventional price+ rebar+ block= or comes close to ICF pricing.

Is this expensive...not at all, when you look at the energy dollars saved over a lifetime.
Can the performance of ICF's be matched by upgrading a conventional basement with additional insulating systems . Never.

Would you compare wood frame performance to ICF's above grade ?
Never, because you could never get a wood frame to match performance in sound, insulation , strength and longevity.

I gave up long ago trying to upsell conventional into ICF.

The customers that buy ICF's do their homework and make an intelligent choice long before they come to me.
And that's the way it should be. Cheers all.

Never say Never.

PanelCrafter,
I thougth you were pro Bush. Sorry I meant SIPs /ICFs. and you said Never sy never . Since this post complaint about ICF cost. Do you know any stick builder advertise, DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY ON ICFs OR SIPs I know how to match performance of ICF and SIP and it will not cost you extra. I do it for same Price of regular stick built HOMES. I don't know any I like hear from others. I say Money does wonders.

Frank

??????

No, I sure don't.

Both estimates appear high compared to what we install ICF for in Montana. Remember that the lower cost estimate you recieved for bare concrete wall would need insulaiton cost added. A ICF estimate in our area would include the ICF forms (including brickledge), rebar, concrete, footings, labor, and the $10,000.00 subcontracted slabs (approx. $9.00 per SF) for UNDER $32,000.00. We do enjoy offering our clients an ICF wall for less than the estimates they get for bare concrete walls. ICF does not have to be, and should not be, more costly than bare concrete.

freak of snow, you have a rather high estimate. I can't understand how someone could figure out a cost at that level. Maybe I am missing something, but here is what we would offer as an estimate. I see that 64' x30' is 1920 sf, but the 2 story is specified as 1700 (150 sf less, so I will base the figures on 64' x 30'. I believe you will be pleasantly suprised at how affordable an ICF home can be. We would include the ICF block, footings, rebar, concrete, floor ledger hangers, $8000 subcontracted slabs, $500 pump truck, and labor. No radiant heat costs are included. There are no deductions for windows, but the savings in ICf and concrete for window/door bucks is approx offset by the window/door bucks and increased labor costs. UNDER $32,000.00