use neo-washers

After some deeper research, I talked with a couple of soundproofing engineers, here is what they concluded:

The SIP must have an air gap between the actual SIP and the interior finish in order to lower the sound levels. At a minimum, a 2" furring channel, then 2" of fiberglass for sound absorption within the cavity, and finally 5/8" drywall. Ideally a wider air space is better, preferably 3"+, the greater the air space between the SIP and the drywall, the better the noise cancellation.

The above formula should reduce or eliminate the "popping" and sound transfer associated with SIPs. Ironically, it is the strength of a SIPs solid one piece construction that causes the sound issues. It's strength causes its weakness when it comes to sound transfer.

I really don't understand your noise problem. I have 10" roof panels and a steel roof. The ceiling of the room below is the bottom of the panel. Yes, before I put up drywall, rain made noise on the metal roof, but once the drywall was on it seemed to absorb the noise of rain pretty well. I haven't had any groaning or popping noises. (At least, not since the contractor severed the nails as previously reported.) My neighbors routinely marvel at how quiet my house is. So I'm very confused about the problem you describe of "popping." Maybe my roofer put furring channels on my roof, or something similar that elevated the roof from the panels slightly. I'll check on that.

Posted By kavade on 04 Mar 2012 04:43 PM
I really don't understand your noise problem. I have 10" roof panels and a steel roof. The ceiling of the room below is the bottom of the panel. Yes, before I put up drywall, rain made noise on the metal roof, but once the drywall was on it seemed to absorb the noise of rain pretty well. I haven't had any groaning or popping noises. (At least, not since the contractor severed the nails as previously reported.) My neighbors routinely marvel at how quiet my house is. So I'm very confused about the problem you describe of "popping." Maybe my roofer put furring channels on my roof, or something similar that elevated the roof from the panels slightly. I'll check on that.

This "noise" issue in steel roof SIPs is a very common problem, just do a Google search and you will find hundreds of hits on it. A SIP is a one-piece unit which transmits noise. There were studies done on this and it was verified that a steel SIP will transmit more noise than a wood framed roof or wall. They (Steel SIP) had the highest sound transmission properties.

The popping is more prevalent when you have vast diurnal temperature swings. Places that see 60F outdoor daytime temps and then 15 hours later, the outdoor temps will be 30F. This fast temperature swing will cause the popping noises due to thermal expansions of different materials.

If one furred out the ceiling, it will help a lot. An air space of 3"+ between the steel SIP and then 5/8" ceiling drywall, will help a lot and eliminate the noise.

Do you have a STEEL SIP roof or OSB SIP roof?

LBEAR; the google search did not reveal any such information, please post a specific link(s), as we have supplied/installed literally hundreds of SIPs buildings , some OSB, but mostly steel and we have not received any call backs for noise issues?

Posted By cmkavala on 05 Mar 2012 07:10 AM
LBEAR; the google search did not reveal any such information, please post a specific link(s), as we have supplied/installed literally hundreds of SIPs buildings , some OSB, but mostly steel and we have not received any call backs for noise issues?

STEEL SIP ROOF NOISE

I really like STEEL SIPs and will most likely utilize them for my home but the issue is real for those climates that experience 30+ degree temperature swings in less than 24 hours. So for a climate that has 5-10 degree swings in 24 hours they will most likely not experience any noise issues.

"On occasion, building owners have reported distinct short burst of sound coming from their structures which include SIPs as a component. This sound has been described as a popping sound. This popping sound has been most often reported in the spring or fall when temperature changes occur rapidly from sunrise to early morning or from evening through sunset. These sounds have also been reported with intermittent changes in sun and cloud cover during peak daylight exposure.

The source of the noise is likely the restraint of construction materials when the materials are undergoing expansion or contraction associated with changes in temperature. The source of the restraint is likely friction between structural components. The sound that is heard is likely the release of the restraint within the building envelope when the expansion (or contraction) overcomes the frictional forces that are resisting the movement. Reports from the SIP industry suggest that the noise will diminish over time. Most importantly, we are aware of no projects reporting this type of noise to be linked with a structural deficiency. We hope you find this information useful.
Respectively submitted,
Todd Bergstrom, Ph.D.
VP Technology"

Posted By Lbear on 05 Mar 2012 02:21 PM

Posted By cmkavala on 05 Mar 2012 07:10 AM
LBEAR; the google search did not reveal any such information, please post a specific link(s), as we have supplied/installed literally hundreds of SIPs buildings , some OSB, but mostly steel and we have not received any call backs for noise issues?

STEEL SIP ROOF NOISE

I really like STEEL SIPs and will most likely utilize them for my home but the issue is real for those climates that experience 30+ degree temperature swings in less than 24 hours. So for a climate that has 5-10 degree swings in 24 hours they will most likely not experience any noise issues.

"On occasion, building owners have reported distinct short burst of sound coming from their structures which include SIPs as a component. This sound has been described as a popping sound. This popping sound has been most often reported in the spring or fall when temperature changes occur rapidly from sunrise to early morning or from evening through sunset. These sounds have also been reported with intermittent changes in sun and cloud cover during peak daylight exposure.

The source of the noise is likely the restraint of construction materials when the materials are undergoing expansion or contraction associated with changes in temperature. The source of the restraint is likely friction between structural components. The sound that is heard is likely the release of the restraint within the building envelope when the expansion (or contraction) overcomes the frictional forces that are resisting the movement. Reports from the SIP industry suggest that the noise will diminish over time. Most importantly, we are aware of no projects reporting this type of noise to be linked with a structural deficiency. We hope you find this information useful.
Respectively submitted,
Todd Bergstrom, Ph.D.
VP Technology"

Lbear;
OK, I read the link, that mentions OSB SIPs (popping) and steel roofing , But no mention of Steel SIPs ????

What is the furthest a steel SIP roof can overhang a wall, in this case it is for shade from the summer sun on the south end of the home? Is it 18" or 24"?

They can overhang much further than that. It depends on wind loads (uplift) and your fastener details. I have an 8' overhang for sun shading (& to cover a balcony) on my south side. It is now supported by a box beam/columns one foot from the edge but was left unsupported (at 8 feet) for a couple of weeks. My fastener connections were not sufficient to meet code if I left that large of an overhang (but I could have added enough additional screws/bolts that it would have). I however would have been concerned about long term creep/sag in the panel.

Posted By Lbear on 06 Mar 2012 03:02 PM
What is the furthest a steel SIP roof can overhang a wall, in this case it is for shade from the summer sun on the south end of the home? Is it 18" or 24"?

Eave overhangs 48" rake overhangs 23"

Posted By cmkavala on 06 Mar 2012 05:46 PM

Posted By Lbear on 06 Mar 2012 03:02 PM
What is the furthest a steel SIP roof can overhang a wall, in this case it is for shade from the summer sun on the south end of the home? Is it 18" or 24"?

Eave overhangs 48" rake overhangs 23"

What is the limiting factor in a SIP for longer overhangs?

Okey-dokey. Thanks for the clarification. My SIPs are OSB, not steel.

Posted By kavade on 07 Mar 2012 06:11 AM
Okey-dokey. Thanks for the clarification. My SIPs are OSB, not steel.

I was referring to a steel SIP roof with a standing seam metal roof on top of the steel SIP. This is where the noise issue comes into play. OSB SIP roofs are not as problematic in regards to noise because of the wood.

Posted By Lbear on 07 Mar 2012 06:14 AM

Posted By kavade on 07 Mar 2012 06:11 AM
Okey-dokey. Thanks for the clarification. My SIPs are OSB, not steel.

I was referring to a steel SIP roof with a standing seam metal roof on top of the steel SIP. This is where the noise issue comes into play. OSB SIP roofs are not as problematic in regards to noise because of the wood.

LBEAR; Since metal SIPs have an air space , then drywall, they are less problematic than OSB

Posted By Lbear on 06 Mar 2012 07:19 PM

Posted By cmkavala on 06 Mar 2012 05:46 PM

Posted By Lbear on 06 Mar 2012 03:02 PM
What is the furthest a steel SIP roof can overhang a wall, in this case it is for shade from the summer sun on the south end of the home? Is it 18" or 24"?

Eave overhangs 48" rake overhangs 23"

What is the limiting factor in a SIP for longer overhangs?

LBEAR;
live & dead loads

We recently purchased a home with a slight pitched roof composite shingles in Palm Springs area. We never heard any noises when we visited the home and purchased during September. Once we moved in October we started hearing loud popping noises in the early morning and sunset. It looks like there is insufficient insulation which I plan to add along with Title 24 White roof coating. Any other suggestions to eliminate or reduce these popping noise? Thank you ! Cory