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Vinmeister
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Posts:14
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| 03/18/2008 7:46 PM |
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I am putting up a Sip house with an icf foundation. The shell is up and I am about to do the windows. They are caparatively large at 3x5 (second fl)and 3x6 (1st fl) Is there something beyond the standard installation process that should be done or can be done to tighten them up? I am told after they are nailed in to spray foam the edges to prevent air leakage. I have already tyveked the house (unnesesary I am told) I will also be foaming in the beam ends between the basement and the first floor and the first and second floor. I am a diy-er
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ReadyToRetire
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Basic Member
Posts:212
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| 03/19/2008 5:03 PM |
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There are some experts on the site -- I'm not one of them! But I've read that you need to use a low expanding foam or you risk bowing the window frame.
Good luck,
Larry
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TLC-ICF
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Posts:88
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| 03/22/2008 8:54 PM |
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| It is common to use a seal tape on the outside. Acts as a seal and flashing at the same time. |
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olpjeb
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New Member
Posts:58
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| 03/23/2008 4:34 PM |
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ReadyToRetire is correct. You need to use a low expanding foam made especially for windows/doors. I used the Great Stuff product that comes in a blue can. My suggestion would be to buy the professional type can and application gun. The foam will be about the same price per unit weight as in the big box stores, but the pro applicator gun will make the work go by quicker. If you use Great Stuff, buy the mid range or higher applicator gun which has an adjustable bead knob. This will allow you to control the amount of foam being expelled from the gun. Also, buy a few gun cleaner cans. It basically is just a pressurized can of acetone, but it will leave the inside of your gun squeaky clean. Otherwise, you will lose the $50 you spent on the gun. While you're at it, buy a can of acetone to clean any foam that gets on your skin or other undesired location. Be sure to clean it quickly because it will not come off once the polyurethane begins to cure.
I can tell you with certainty that the above is worth the extra money (maybe $75 above buying individual retail cans). You will save time and minimize the mess.
Be sure to also foam all other SIP penetrations such as exhaust vents, plumbing vents, dryer exhaust, furnace/heater exhausts. |
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ronaldsauve
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Posts:17
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| 04/01/2008 10:28 PM |
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On the Tyvek/Typar or whatever housewrap you use: It is necessary. The purpose of housewrap is not only to provide an air barrier, but also to provide a water barrier, i.e. to keep water off the wall. It is important to install the housewrap from the bottom to the top, overlapping the bottom courses with the top so that any water coming down the wall will drain away, rather than into the wall. Also it is important to tape all of the joints with the tape approved for this application. First, install the housewrap. Then cut out the window and door openings. Install an ice and water shield at the bottom of the opening, wrapping it into the opening, up the sides about 6", and down onto the housewrap about the same amount. Make sure the corners are well sealed when you are done. Slit the housewrap diagonally up a few inches from the top corners of the window openings. If you are using Andersen casements or awnings, you will have a flange all around the window. Caulk around the opening with a good quality urethane caulk/sealant, then set the window, level, and nail it all around. Install ice and water shield down the sides of the window, (tucking it under the flap of the housewrap you just made at the top of the window), and over the side window flanges and out far enough so that it goes beyond whatever width trim you will use around the window or door. This will ensure that the joint between trim and siding will not allow water entry. Install one more piece of ice and water shield over the top flange of the window and over the side pieces, and tuck it under the housewrap flap at the top of the window. Finally, tape the housewrap flap at the top of the window onto the ice and water shield. You now have a window installation that should never leak. Doors are treated in much the same way. One thing I like to do with doors, is install a piece of copper flashing under the door, turning up about a 1/4" lip inside the door sill. I run the copper out from under the door and down the outside of the house to the foundation and end it just below the junction of the foundation and house wall. I lay down urethane caulk under the door sill, and set the door. I follow the same procedures as for the windows mentioned above. I then run the door casings down to the same point, just over the foundation wall. You now have an installation that will never have the typical rotted sill boards under the door that always seem to need painting every year, and eventually end up needing replacement, and usually needing structural work under them as well. What kind of siding will you be using? If clapboard, then an excellent step to take is to install vertical strapping 16" on center over the housewrap, screen the bottoms and tops to keep insects out, then install the clapboards. You will then have a rainscreen on your walls that will keep water out of them. You will thus avoid ever having rotted sheathing which can be a much bigger problem with SIP's than with a framed wall.
Hope this doesn't sound too confusing to you, but if you follow these suggestions, you should have no problems with water in the wall. |
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coppcar
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New Member
Posts:3
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| 04/02/2008 12:13 PM |
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| There is an excellent book on the subject of the previous post that has excellent illustrations of this procedure. It's "Water Management Guide", by Joseph W. Lstiburek, ISBN 0-9755127-5-7. I learned how to properly close up windows and doors using the book. I wish I had known this information years ago. |
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Vinmeister
Registered Users
New Member
Posts:14
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| 04/05/2008 2:04 PM |
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Hi
I have read the replies and perhaps am dense. I did make a boo boo when cutting for my window openings in the sips. I did it from inside AFTER I put on the tyvek. As a result I have no material to wrap aound and into the inside of the window opening. After the framing is setshould an ice and water shield be applied over th face and edge of the sheathing and into the opening before you set the window and then again something over the nailing flange? The idea of slicing the tyvec to overlap the nailing flange on the top makes alotr of sense to me but should there be any more? I did put the tyvek on so it would shed water (it is right now my all american rural siding until I get to that point)
Is roof adhesive ice and water shield a good candidate for the window install material?
BTW I have read ronaldsauve's reply about 5 times now I think I may be starting to get it.
Thanks one and all. |
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coppcar
Registered Users
New Member
Posts:3
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| 04/05/2008 6:14 PM |
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I am a DIY, not a professional. In my opinion I would do something to seal that window sill area before installing the window and again around the nailing flange. Use the input from other more experienced posters to decide on the approach best for your situation.
The building supply companies sell a butyl rubber tape that is about 4" wide for sealing doors and windows, commonly referred to (at least where I live) as window and door flashing. Tyvek has their brand and there are others. Mine is called ProSAF Mold Blocker, http://www.schneemorehead.com/pdf-sm/PIPROSAFflexTDS.pdf. In my limited DIY experience I've never handled or seen Ice and Water shield, however, if it's a butyl rubber material that sticks, I'm sure it would work well for sealing that sill area. Be sure to get a good seal in the corners.
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