100k House Project and SIPs - GreenBuildingTalk - GreenBuildingTalk - Green Building Forums on Insulating Concrete Forms (ICF), Structural Insulated Panels (SIP), Radiant Heating, Geothermal Heat Pumps, Solar Power, Green Construction Projects - Green Building Technologies

Forums

Unanswered Active Topics

Forums Search Members

Forums > Green Building Technologies > Structural Insulated Panels (SIPs)

100k House Project and SIPs

Last Post 22 Jan 2008 12:08 PM by Gsfrey. 4 Replies.

Sort:

	Prev Next
You are not authorized to post a reply.

Author

Messages

Peter B.

New Member

Posts:6

21 Jan 2008 09:54 PM
There is a blog I regularly read that details the design and building of a 100k house. They are currently weighing their options in regards to choosing SIP over stick and bat construction that you can read at the following link. It seems like they're being discouraged by some of the issues I've seen discussed here. Since I'm not entirely up to speed on all the ins-and-outs of SIP pros and cons, does anyone see anything incorrect in their presumptions? "While I was initially very excited about using SIPs for these homes, some doubts have crept in that I am looking forward to addressing in more detail with the manufacturers. One of the main issues is our party walls in Philadelphia that must achieve a 2 hour fire rating in between new homes. One and possibly even two layers of SIPs will most likely not solve this requirement. The other issues is how to support the roof panels. If an extensive beam or truss system is required it will increase our material costs, effect our interior appearance and increase the need for traditional framers on the jobsite. As we get farther away from a full SIP home and closer to a 50-50 hybrid of SIP and traditional framing I get less excited as I envision the cost savings from efficiency starting to deteriorate… Lastly, I have received some conflicting opinions on SIP assembly, sealing and exterior cladding that I am hoping to clear up and educate the team further on as we are all fairly new to SIPs and have no personal experience with a SIP project in Philly." It would be cool to see a low-cost, green, modern housing project like this be able to be a showcase for SIPs.

PanelCrafters User is Offline

Advanced Member

Posts:680

21 Jan 2008 10:47 PM
Posted By moibiusmuse on 01/21/2008 9:54 PM "While I was initially very excited about using SIPs for these homes, some doubts have crept in that I am looking forward to addressing in more detail with the manufacturers. One of the main issues is our party walls in Philadelphia that must achieve a 2 hour fire rating in between new homes. One and possibly even two layers of SIPs will most likely not solve this requirement. An additional layer of drywall will solve this problem. The other issues is how to support the roof panels. If an extensive beam or truss system is required it will increase our material costs, effect our interior appearance and increase the need for traditional framers on the jobsite. The need for beams depends on the span and load applied to the roof panels. We would need further info to give them an opinion. Lastly, I have received some conflicting opinions on SIP assembly, sealing and exterior cladding that I am hoping to clear up and educate the team further on as we are all fairly new to SIPs and have no personal experience with a SIP project in Philly." Assembly and sealing would depend on the SIP system. In some cases the system's are easy for the novice to install correctly, and in other cases they require a professional.

....jc<br>If you're not building with OSB SIPS(or ICF's), why are you building?

Lockard

New Member

Posts:40

22 Jan 2008 12:37 AM
Posted By moibiusmuse on 01/21/2008 9:54 PM "While I was initially very excited about using SIPs for these homes, some doubts have crept in that I am looking forward to addressing in more detail with the manufacturers. One of the main issues is our party walls in Philadelphia that must achieve a 2 hour fire rating in between new homes. One and possibly even two layers of SIPs will most likely not solve this requirement. The other issues is how to support the roof panels. If an extensive beam or truss system is required it will increase our material costs, effect our interior appearance and increase the need for traditional framers on the jobsite. As we get farther away from a full SIP home and closer to a 50-50 hybrid of SIP and traditional framing I get less excited as I envision the cost savings from efficiency starting to deteriorate… Lastly, I have received some conflicting opinions on SIP assembly, sealing and exterior cladding that I am hoping to clear up and educate the team further on as we are all fairly new to SIPs and have no personal experience with a SIP project in Philly." moibiusmuse, Look into Polyurethane SIPs. I believe they have the highest class fire rating for residential construction in the trade. No need for extra layers of rock or double walls. Polyurethane SIPs are a thermoset plastic that cannot melt or contribute to flame spread until consumed, over 700° F. I think EPS foam starts to melt below 200° F. Supporting roofs with beams has been around for ages. They are quick and simple. I know they aren't cheap, but neither is labor or the materials needed for traditional stick framing. The company we use would be happy to send a full install crew, or send a supervisor to work with your team. Whatever you do, use SIPs. They are stronger, faster, and are a higher value method of building than sticks. You'll come out way ahead in the long run.

Lockard

cmkavala

Veteran Member

Posts:4327
Avatar

22 Jan 2008 09:46 AM
Posted By moibiusmuse on 01/21/2008 9:54 PM One of the main issues is our party walls in Philadelphia that must achieve a 2 hour fire rating in between new homes. The answer is: then don't use sips for the firewall, use conventional framing. insulation is not a factor for an interior party wall partition. problem solved!

Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br />

Greg Freyermuth User is Offline

Basic Member

Posts:131

22 Jan 2008 12:08 PM
We are doing a 64 condo project in New Mexico. We have no party or fire wall issues. We have looked at a couple of options: 1. Instead of 41/2" SIPS use a 61/2" for the common walls. 2. Gap the party wall and use a 41/2" SIP for both walls in the condos. The concrete is monslab, the roof is one piece, trusses span multiple units. The gap also helps greatly with the soundproofing. Because of this we went with the 2-4 1/2" walls with a small gap between the units. We are price point competitive and can build faster. For the developer it was a no brainer. I even found an open minded architect who helped us design the condos specifically for SIPS. Multi-family, high density stuff is right smack dab in our sweet spot and we beat our competitors on price and speed everytime. It makes us awfully appealing to those who are building as investments.

Greg Freyermuth<br>915-256-7563<br>[email protected]<br> www.energreensips.com