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Radiant--sips---waterheaters.
Last Post 18 Jan 2008 10:10 AM by racer1. 3 Replies.
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racer1
 New Member
 Posts:7
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| 17 Jan 2008 04:42 PM |
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ok guys here goes...Ive never posted on here before. just lurked and read alot..I'm going to answer a bunch of things asked on these forums at one time.. As per MY experience... I built a sip home myself 3 yrs ago... Researched co. and chose enercept in S.D....They do all engineering and cut outs etc . etc....Comes to site ready to put up, with very specific plans and directions....All panels lettered and numbered........A 10 yr old could follow the plans!!!!!.....So, the house is 34x36 ft. full basement. One side a walkout into a 3 car garage, the width of the house 34'....I chose to go with enercepts wood foundation panels...Yes I know this freeks most people out...OMG....a wood basement !!! It will rot and the house will fall down, Bla bla bla......NO it doesnt.....But you cant change some peoples minds. The foundation panels are R-32 insulated...Lets see, concrete alone. R-.001 or something....you do the math.....I had a contractor dig and pour a foundation. then i bolted on sill panel, then put up sip foundation panels up as normal. nailing all along as nessesary..Although, I'm the guy that if 2 nails is enough, I use 4....All panels fit like a glove, and only need for cutting is at corners. none is perfect, so they leave a little fudge factor on end panels.. So, when all panels are up. I had 4 pcs of scrape, 1" wide and 9' tall, cut off ends to align panel corners...Then you put top plates in panels. 2x6 lumber. that squares everything off together, and levels top of panel for floor system. Oh I did put a steel beam down center of house to hold floor joists. Next, I used top hanging Joist hangers on top of wall to hold my 2x4 floor truses. I personally think floor trusses are better that I joists.....Just My opinion....Trusses go from wall to center steel beam.!7' span, 12' truss...Now Flooring is ready to be put down. ..I used 3/4 osb for floor. I put panel adhesive down then nail with double galvanized ring shank nails throghout house. Overkill, maybe. will my house come apart? hell no!!!!...LOL....So, When I put down the osb, it overlaps the truses and goes out to the edge of the sip wall. NO area for any air infiltration between floors...Now the basement is decked. then I put sealer down and put sill plates all around the outside edge for my sip walls. I am a little crazy as stated earlier. I used big freeken lag bolts to put sill plates on....Then put up sip walls. using sealer first then setting panels, then nailing everthing. Again with ring shank nails....They work awsome, BUT....You cant pull them out if needed. have to break them off!!!...Then set the Gable ends . My house has 20' cathedral cielings. hense the gable ends.......Next step was to get crane, and set the roof. ....Enercept did all the engineering, and sent my arch. structural wood beam for cieling with my package. We set the 36' long wood beam in using the crane. It sits in premade pockets in gable ends. screwed beam in place. Then set my roof panels. ...4' wide and 24 ft long. 8/12 pitch.. Panels set on center beam and free span to side wall. 14" screws every 12" into side walls and beam. Panels have an I joist on sides to slide into next panel for their support. then nailed both sides all way up panel. Of course sealer is put between panels....2' overhang on sides and 2' overhang on ends. when roof is up. They have a miter cut glue lam board that goes in the ends of roof panels to finish them out. It gives you a big facia, but I dont mind...So now basic shell is up. All window and door openings were cut out and built into panels. Enercept uses 4 pcs to make a opening, top bottom 2 sides. I feel it gives better support as it now has a jack stud on each side of opening for any loads. I have a 6' wide french door in gable wall. So the importance of support is HUGE since my roof beam is centered on that door opening...And waste for the entire project was 8 pcs that I had to cut off to adjust the corners...I think that is incredible...To each his own, but I would never want to have to fabricate on site...This was so easy. Ive read on here people having problems, and having nightmares....My experience with enercept was awsome......Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.....So Back to the basement walls. I primed the treated exterior grade plywood that the panels are made of. then, Again cause I do overkill.....I covered the walls with a ribbed sticky membrane rubber material. 3' wide and ran it up and down. I ran it down enough to go over the foundation lip and down the side of the foundation. (concrete)....And up high enough to cover the connection between the first floor and basement panel....no water, NO air.....So what Ive done is created a comlpetely water tight set up....cont. in Part 2
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racer1
 New Member
 Posts:7
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| 17 Jan 2008 05:31 PM |
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Part 2...ran out of space...After that, I ran drain tile around foundation, and covered with stone. Then when I backfilled the 3 sides, I used 3' wide of clear stone up against the foundation. then put dirt blocking membrane on stone, then dirt last 2 ' for grass and such....Need membrane to keep dirt from sinking in to stone and clogging. Here in Wis. i used the stone to isolate the foundation walls from heaving in sub zero weather. And gives me NO water problems....I put tyvek on whole exterior of house. I know some people dont like it.. My choice...I put Log siding on house. and the tyvek gives a barrier to drain water down and out the wall....... As for the Basement. I put down a vapor barrier on the ground. then put down 2" of foam, then laid wire mesh on top of that, then I zip tied pex tubing to the mesh for my radiant floor heat. did 5 zones...Then poured the concrete floor. As for my heating plant. This is where many people disagree. I did it my way, your mileage will vary....I ran a 5 port manifold for the pex pipe. ran it thru a 110 volt pump. very small amps. .55 i think. then thru air bleeder, then an expansion tank. then to A Takagi. Jr. tankless water heater. I've seen people put in these wildly complicated systems, and I said there has to be a better way!!!!!.....So, I use a 110 volt thermostat. when It clicks on it sends 110 volts to pump. The pump kicks on, the water heater senses water movement and fires up heat. Its a variable burner unit. It measures incoming water temp and outgoing and adjusts the burner accordingly. All the expensive stuff is built in itself.....Ive seen systems with huge control panels and valves and sensors, and all kinds of plumbing....I have a water heater, a pump and a thermostat.....It works fantastic, at a fraction of what ive seen people spend....heater does from 18,000-140,000 btu's... Now for heat up stairs, I wanted to experiment. So I put electric baseboard up here. Its an open concepy floor plan. 20' ceiling, with a loft. 2 bedrooms and bath under loft. 6' french doors, 7 big windows, 2 regular walk in doors. n All this in great room, kitchen area. Right now it's 20 degrees outside, wind howling. The temperature in my house is 66 degrees. I like it a little cool myself.. Only 1 thats right 1 degree difference from floor to ceiling. My heating system........1...7' baseboard electric heater in great room, and a 30 " heater one bedroom....I know your saying Bull crap!!!!...But Its the truth......2000watts of heat, and 750 watts of heat...Thats it.....Damn I love Sips.....And Last summer, I put in a wndow a/c unit, just to see. Its a 5000 btu cheapie thing. At 95 degrees and humid as hell. My house was 78 degrees and comfy....I had the unit set on 7...1-10 scale. and med fan setting...2 ceiling fans run on very slow to move air a bit......I know what your thinkin, Im full of crap. But I can back it up. Anyone can visit me.... So to sum up my experience.....My foundation walls, took 5.5 hrs with 4 guys.....then I decked it....Side walls, 6 hrs, 3 guys. gable ends, 4 hrs 3 guys....roof panels 7.5 hrs 4 guys and crane operator... Whole sip adventure was great. Ive never built a house before. But The sip part was easy..The rest of the house is where my inexpperience got me....lol.......Would I do It again. Absolutely....And I would use enercept again. I would be glad to answer any questions concerning my build. Im only knowledgeable about my house and dont claim to be an expert on anything. I just thought i would share my experience with all of you. I hope it may help someone in some small way......Oh one little tidbit. My best freind is an electriction and did my house....He yelled at me the whole time.....LOL....It took much longer than traditional sticks, and pissed and moaned the whole time......gees I wrote a book...LOL .....Jim....... In Madison Wis.
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NRT.Rob
 Veteran Member
 Posts:1741
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| 18 Jan 2008 09:09 AM |
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Hi Jim,
thanks for sharing!
Just to clarify, for the type of radiant system you are doing (a single zone of high mass in a basement), a simple system is always a fine choice. I'm not sure why you would switch to electric baseboard on the first floor (or, if electric makes sense, why not use an electric boiler downstairs)? Regardless, the better the job you do on your envelope, the better comfort and results you're going to get... always, hands down, no arguement. the building envelope is the most important part of any mechanical system.
Glad it's working so well for you! |
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| Rockport Mechanical<br>RockportMechanical.com |
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racer1
 New Member
 Posts:7
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| 18 Jan 2008 10:10 AM |
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Rob, Thanks for the reply. Yes, for simple needs, I think my simple "diy "system works. I am by no means an expert...But for one big zone it works very good...I put the baseboard thing upstairs, just for an experiment to see how little i could get away with....I did install a forced air system in last yr, for the upstairs. Only because when I sell, I would have to have central a/c or people wont even look at the place...But with propane here at 2.60 per gal. My basic electric system, is cheaper to operate...at least as of now...Right now I dont even have the radiant on, because i'm not using basement level now.....I'm single, and have a hard time justifying heating the whole 3200 sq ft. just for one person....I'm still kinda experimenting with my sip structure, to see what differnt things do under different conditions....Like you said. the main thing in all of this is How tight, and insulated is the structure your dealing with.....The best of the best systems cant make up for a crappy house.........Jim
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