Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 29 Feb 2008 08:52 AM |
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This is my first post here. I have been lurking here for more than a year. Background on the project. 1200sf home with 1200sf heated garage/shop. 160lf of ICF the rest 2x6 spay foam walls. Radiant floors 4in over 2in insulation. r60 healed scissor trusses. Located in central wisconsin. Zone 3. Facing due south in a wind free loaction. North facing wall (icf) will be completely burried in the hill. The other 2 icf walls are the east wall and the one between the house and garage. I can post a floor plan if that will help.
I know that is not the correct fourm. I am hopeing that you can point me in the correct direction.
1 I have not done a heat loss calculation. (low, close to Passive solar) House should be passive, garage/shop no way too much loss through the doors.
2 I do not know what I want to heat with. Probally not geothermal (sorry) Something cheap to install and run.
3 The house will share a well with our farm. Small 4 horses, a few goats, sheep, dogs. I am looking for a way to pull cool air for AC of to the water comsumtion of the farm. I will be irrigating the pastors most of the summer, 7 acres, not all at once. We pratice rotional grazing, this helps them recover faster.
4 I am currently leaning twards a well sorce heat pump. I will using well water that I allredy need to use in the summer. I the winter I am not so sure. Some water use on the farm (apx 40gal and some in the house, dish washing, showers ect.)
What is everyones opinions. Tell me the way it is(I have been wrong before). I can only gather so much information on my own.
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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TechGromit
Advanced Member
Posts:634
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| 29 Feb 2008 09:36 AM |
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Posted By Naudi2u on 02/29/2008 8:52 AM
4 I am currently leaning twards a well sorce heat pump. I will using well water that I allredy need to use in the summer. I the winter I am not so sure. Some water use on the farm (apx 40gal and some in the house, dish washing, showers ect.)
Isn't a well source heat pump the same as an Open Loop Geothermal system? As for operating costs, nothing is cheaper to run than a Geothermal system. |
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Palace Geothermal
Veteran Member
Posts:1609
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| 29 Feb 2008 10:54 AM |
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Posted By TechGromit on 02/29/2008 9:36 AM Posted By Naudi2u on 02/29/2008 8:52 AM
4 I am currently leaning towards a well sorce heat pump.
Isn't a well source heat pump the same as an Open Loop Geothermal system? Yes . I just don't understand why people won't do a heat loss, yet they want help in designing a heating system.
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Dewayne Dean
<br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 29 Feb 2008 11:59 AM |
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I have not done one yet, give me a hour and I will get you one. sheees
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 29 Feb 2008 01:17 PM |
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Well I don't know if this right. 6100 for the house and 9600 for the garage. I do not know how to figure out the gain that I will have from the passive solar design. In a open loop geothermal can the output water be used for domestic water? Not a huge deal because in the summer it will be used by the farm. Just thinking what can be done in the winter.
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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TechGromit
Advanced Member
Posts:634
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| 29 Feb 2008 11:33 PM |
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Posted By Naudi2u on 02/29/2008 1:17 PM
Well I don't know if this right. 6100 for the house and 9600 for the garage. I do not know how to figure out the gain that I will have from the passive solar design. In a open loop geothermal can the output water be used for domestic water? Not a huge deal because in the summer it will be used by the farm. Just thinking what can be done in the winter.
I don't know, those figures sound awfully low to me. The example geodean provided for me in another topic had the heat loss for the windows alone at a 20k btu loss. Your passive solar design isn't going to do squat at night. You need to go back and rework those figures without factoring in your passive solar design, unless you want to get an undersized system that only keeps you warm during the day, your going to be sorry when the sun goes down. I don't see why you cant use the geothemal water output, since the geothemal unit is doing nothing but extracting heat from it. Mine open loop system feeds some outside ponds in the summer time. But if your considering connecting your kitchen sink to the geothermal system, I dont think that's going to work too well. There's no reason the same well pump that provides water to the geothermal unit cant feed the rest of the house off of a T connection. |
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Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 01 Mar 2008 09:24 AM |
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Posted By TechGromit on 02/29/2008 11:33 PM
[/quote]I don't know, those figures sound awfully low to me. The example geodean provided for me in another topic had the heat loss for the windows alone at a 20k btu loss. Your passive solar design isn't going to do squat at night. You need to go back and rework those figures without factoring in your passive solar design, unless you want to get an undersized system that only keeps you warm during the day, your going to be sorry when the sun goes down.
[b]
The passive solar is NOT figured into calculations! The north wall of
the house and garage are icf, that is fully buried in the ground. The
house and garage common seperating wall is also icf. This house has a
very small footprint. I will draw up some quick and dirty plans. The
passive solar WILL do some for me at night. 1 It will heat the floor
all day. 2 passive solar designs Add insulating curtains that are
lowered at night to cut loss.[/b]
I don't see why you cant use the geothemal water output, since the geothemal unit is doing nothing but extracting heat from it. Mine open loop system feeds some outside ponds in the summer time. But if your considering connecting your kitchen sink to the geothermal system, I dont think that's going to work too well. There's no reason the same well pump that provides water to the geothermal unit cant feed the rest of the house off of a T connection.
[b]Yes I understand open loop Geothermal systems. I built a house 13
years ago that had one. But all the water was waisted, creating a wet
spot down the hill side. They are also on their 3rd well pump. We are
not in an area of water conversation, But I think that would be the
GREEN thing to do. Let me be specific, can the output of the water after the heat exchanger, be
used for domestic applications under building code? I know that I can,
any thing is possible but will the building inspector like it. In our rural area, inspectors are not happy with thing that they are not common. I am not familiar with this part of the code and I
THOUGHT that people on this forum could help me with that because you
have dealt with these issues before.[/b]
[/quote]
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 01 Mar 2008 09:52 AM |
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Click here For floor plan |
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 01 Mar 2008 09:55 AM |
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Or not, lets try something different
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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Naudi2u
New Member
Posts:49
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| 01 Mar 2008 10:06 AM |
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here quickly, 120 sqf of window 300sqf of garage doors What do you get for a loss out of that.
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| Carlo<br><br> |
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Palace Geothermal
Veteran Member
Posts:1609
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| 01 Mar 2008 07:27 PM |
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Posted By Naudi2u on 03/01/2008 9:24 AM
Let me be specific, can the output of the water after the heat exchanger, be
used for domestic applications under building code? I know that I can,
any thing is possible but will the building inspector like it.
This is really a question you need to ask your local official. What we might be allowed to do here in Utah, really has no bearing on what you would be allowed to do in your area. IMHO, it is your water and you can drink it if you want to. I see nothing wrong with it. How do you plan to store the water after if goes through the heat pump until you need it for your domestic needs? Let us know what you find out. Good luck with your project.
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Dewayne Dean
<br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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Palace Geothermal
Veteran Member
Posts:1609
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| 01 Mar 2008 08:19 PM |
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Posted By Naudi2u on 02/29/2008 1:17 PM
Well I don't know if this right. 6100 for the house and 9600 for the garage. I do not know how to figure out the gain that I will have from the passive solar design.
Those numbers might be right. For a super insulated house such as yours, it doesn't take much to heat it. TechGromit makes a good point about sizing your system not to rely too much on the solar. What ever free heat your solar does give will reduce the amount you have to pay for. Are you planning any kind of ventilation system with energy recovery? This might be your biggest heat loss. Sorry that we are not giving you the kind of help you were expecting. We try to help where we can.
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Dewayne Dean
<br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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