i am considering starting a business that would install geo thermal heating for a residential market in Wisconsin. Can anyone here provide information regarding where i can find the necessary training, certifications and just in general where i can go to get information regarding becoming an installer/contractor? Any association or whatever, just would like to start finding any info i can.

Are you an existing HVAC contractor that is thinking of expanding there line of products you provide / service or you completely new to any type of HVAC work? If your completely new, I would suggest working for someone else first in the HVAC field for a couple of years, even if it isn't specifically Geothermal systems to get expereince first before jumping right in a starting a bussiness.

 

Try this website.

Good Luck and let us know how it goes.

I don't have a back ground in HVAC so don't let that slow you down.

Check out ecrtech.com and click on News. There are trainings listed there. EarthLinked is a great product, and you'd be best off with it as your geo line.

UPDATE

ECR is in the process of updating website as of May 10th. Changing over from ecrtech.com to Earthlinked.com

Theres a really good training company who offers all sorts of classes. There on the road so you can catch them somewhere as local as possible. Just completed IGSHPA traing with them and also took some service classes from them. There HeatSpring do a google on them.GOOD LUUUUCK best thing i ever did with my career is go GEO!!!!!

Can't say I agree. If you were going to hire someone install your system, given two contractors would you pick the guy fresh out of school and he's going to pratice what he's learned his very first house, (ie You) or a contractor that's fresh out of school but has worked in the HVAC field for several years?

I'd pick experience. You can't substitue good experience with book smarts no matter how bright you are. 



 

You have a pretty narrow field of view there.

Most HVAC guys would not make good geo contractors. They don't do heat load calcs, they size by the "rule of thumb" they routinely oversize systems to CYA, their ductwork is usually undersized, they don't insulate ductwork, and so on.

The truth is being a HVAC contractor does not do much to prepare you in any way to be a geo contractor other than giving you an understanding of refrigeration.

To be a good geo contractor you need to understand soil types, be able to do comprehensive heat load calcs, size ground loops, understand building reverse return headers, calculate pressure drops across loop fields and heat pumps, calculate loop volume, know how to fuse HDPE pipe, calculate system paybacks, know how to purge air from a loop system, to name a few. Regular HVAC contractors do none of these.

You are right that some one just out of geo school might not be ready to go into business for themselves. But having a back ground in HVAC is not a big plus.

The best plan would be to work for a geo company and get experience that way. I have been a geo contractor for three years, have installed systems from 2 tons to 400 tons. We have done vertical systems, horizontal systems, pond loops and open loops.

I didn't have a HVAC background when I started in this business.

Would you care to share your qualifications?

Well said geodean.

Absolutely, I've install plenty of window air conditioners in lots of houses. I've even used electric resistance heaters and torpedo heaters in garages. I've been the project manager for many camp fires. I think I'm more then qualified to install a geo system in your house, anyone want to hire me? :)

I do have a couple years experience as an electrician, I have a 19 year old Geothermal system and I'm handy around the house. Other than that I'm completely worthless.

 

I am amazed that someone would say geothermal doesnt require HVAC experiance. Its all HVAC related.Ive got 17 yrs HVAC and let me tell ya it made geothermal elementary for me. Most reputable HVAC contractors always do manuel Js and duculator sizing. I know of people with no HVAC experiance trying to get into this and its difficult.

I am amazed that someone would say that geothermal requires HVAC experience. I have no HVAC experience, yet have been installing geo systems for three years. I hire some one to do the ductwork for me.

This industry needs good honest people to join the ranks. Telling some one that they can't get in with out HVAC experience is a bad idea in my opinion.

Certainly a background in HVAC can be an advantage.

I don't buy it - "HVAC Experience" is not precluded by having someone else "do the ductwork" To have successfully installed geo systems you'd have to have a good grasp of the basic concepts of building loads and how HVAC equipment works.

If by "installing geo systems" you mean merely taking someone else's heating and cooling load calculations and designing a horizontal, vertical or open loop plumbing system based on local soil composition and temperatures, then I would argue that you haven't really been "installing geo systems"

If, on the other hand you design the whole system (Manuals J, D, and S) and are able to farm out the tedium of running ducts that seems to me an excellent business plan assuming quality ductwork installers can be found who will follow directions and provide good workmanship. (That is precisely the direction I'm headed at the moment)

No offense intended, but, based on the precise and accurate content of some of your earlier posts, you are here perhaps sandbagging a bit...

I'm a couple days from getting CO on our 14 month long replacement house project, an upshot of which is my builder and I plan a joint venture wherein I'll take on design and supervision responsibility for both the HVAC and water sides of closed loop vertical geo systems for his future custom houses. This stems from his ongoing frustration with the quality of local HVAC subs (not a one remotely competent with zoning, Manuals J, S, and D or even 2 speed systems) and the distance (300 miles) and expense of his current geo well sub. That and that both sides are now separate creates unproductive finger pointing when inevitable problems arise.

We're both committed to comfortable, quiet, efficient and economical HVAC systems for his custom home buyers. Four or so $1 Million plus houses are in his pipeline, so things are bound to get really interesting really soon.

We are at a national tipping point with regard to the demand for top-quality, 'Green', comfortable, lowest life-cycle-cost residential systems. Any entity willing to embrace complete technical mental ownership of the entire system including heating, cooling, humidity, IAQ and domestic hot water is bound to succeed even in a bad housing market simply because the vast majority of present players are hopelessly incompetent hacks.

Nifty elegant technologies are right around the corner - stay tuned. Four immediately pop to mind: 1) Inverter-based high-turndown compressors able to respond to a wide range of loads and thus continually provide optimal dehumidification. 2) Microprocessor-based refrigerant control systems able to simultaneously heat and cool different zones. 3) Systems able to cycle the compressor solely in response to demand for domestic hot water independent of heating and cooling loads. 4) Variable-speed / variable frequency pumps able to efficiently flow just the right amount of loop fluid needed in support of #1,2,3 above.

Today's 2 speed compressor systems mated with variable speed ECM blowers are a huge improvement over earlier units, but the best has yet to come. That and the present cost spikes of all forms of energy combined with the global fixation on 'green' means great opportunity for those willing to take mental ownership of cutting-edge innovations

Engineer,

Will you be doing geothermal projects in the Southeast?  If so, let me know how to contact you.

No offense taken:)  

 I have never said that I don't understand how to do loads and how HVAC equipment works,  I obviously do now after spending upwards of $15,000  attending training classes all over the country.


The point I have been trying to make in this thread is that you can learn all of that after you decide to become a geo installer like I did.

I am trying to not let others discourage any one from getting into the business.   As you said,  the demand for good installers in the coming years is going to be huge.

I appreciate your insight into what advances we can expect in the new equipment.

m sorry but you can spend all you want on classes.Extensive HVAC experiance is in field time.Schools great but when it comes time to apply school in the field its a differant world!We or I do it all. Design,Install,Service,wire,etc...18 yrs in the field allows this. Not 1 yr and 15k in classes.

Alton,

I'm based south of Jax, FL. I've sent you contact via the email provision in your profile here

I am not sure that the email function through the profiles works on these forums.


If you send a PM, I know those go through.

What exactly is your point? 

I  also design, install, service, wire, etc .... plus I know how to spell.

Funny Geodean Im not looking for an argument. Good luck with yourself. I meant no harm. Just companies who think all they need is a book and there a Geo contractor well it usually hinders the field for the rest of us who have made this there only career from day one.