macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 21 Nov 2008 08:51 PM |
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I have just had the installation on my split sytem installed and is now working. We had the geo cube unit installed in my laundry room. It seems really noisy to me; it sounds like a loud refrigerator running. The loops are not completely covered yet (will be tonight) and unfortunately, these guys did the installation when it was snowing and between 15 and 30 degrees this week (they were troopers, I must say). The installer tells me that what I am hearing is normal and that the noise will subside somewhat once the system is completely where it needs to be in terms of loops being underground and the dirt gets back to it's regular temperature. Our plan is to frame it in somewhat and insulate the unit with that blue foam insulation. Anyone have any thoughts on this? It's very quiet coming out of the vents, just noisy when it's running. |
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tuffluckdriller
 Advanced Member
 Posts:630

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| 22 Nov 2008 01:28 AM |
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What type of system? |
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| Clark Timothy ([email protected])<br>Geothermal Heat Pumps: Heating and Cooling that's Dirt Cheap!<br>www.pinksgeothermal.com |
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engineer
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2749
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| 22 Nov 2008 07:54 AM |
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I'm skeptical there is a connection between incomplete loop burial and unit noise, but let the troopers finish up.
Actually "loud refrigerator" is about right - the unit has a compressor on the order of 10 times larger than that in a typical fridge.
Regarding noise mitigation, be sure to distinguish between the noise from the unit itself verses noise resulting from vibration.
Framing the unit into an insulated box will likely help with noise but not necessarily vibration. There is also a chance installers forgot to remove compressor shipping bolts - if that is the case, you are in for a pleasant suprise when the do take them out - it'll get much quieter |
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Curt Kinder <br><br>
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 22 Nov 2008 08:42 AM |
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It is a waterfurnace premier. |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 22 Nov 2008 08:50 AM |
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THere is certainly vibration, I can feel it through the floor when I'm standing in the hallway ( the unit is in the laundry room). If it is vibration, what can I do about it? I have at least noticed a reduction in the use of kw hours... |
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Palace Geothermal
 Veteran Member
 Posts:1609
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| 22 Nov 2008 08:54 AM |
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Are there any type of vibration pads installed under the unit? |
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Dewayne Dean <br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 22 Nov 2008 09:13 AM |
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I don't know...there is a big gray plastic tray thing underneath. |
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Palace Geothermal
 Veteran Member
 Posts:1609
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| 22 Nov 2008 09:15 AM |
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The tray would be to catch any water in case of a leak. Is there a gap between the bottom of the unit and the tray? |
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Dewayne Dean <br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 22 Nov 2008 09:47 AM |
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The tray is not situated to catch any leaks...it is upside down if that is the case. There is not a gap between the unit and the tray. |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 23 Nov 2008 08:34 AM |
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I've been reading other posts and read about the 90% running time...it's only been in operation for less than 48 hours but it seems to be running 90% of the time or more. Would that be because it's only 16 degrees outside, and we haven't hit 30 in a week and therefore the ground loops are still cold from exposure and the dirt sat out of the trench for a day? When I speak to the contractor again on Monday I want to have all my questions lined out. It's definitely heating, and that is great. Also, we have a large living room with an elevated ceiling. It is 5-8 degrees cooler than the rest of the house even though the put an 10 x 14 air intake in the floor. I'm not sure how much air it's taking in...I appreciate all of your answers! I have learned alot and my contractor is suprised with my knowledge base! |
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Palace Geothermal
 Veteran Member
 Posts:1609
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| 23 Nov 2008 10:43 AM |
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It sounds like the plastic tray is some sort of sound pad. If it is hard plastic, it could be transferring the vibration to the wood floor. There are rubber vibration pads available. We have used rigid foam in the past with good results.
48 hours is not quite enough time to come to any conclusions about performance. I doubt that the run time is affected by any of the events that occurred while installing your loop.
How many heat runs are installed in your large living room? |
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Dewayne Dean <br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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engineer
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2749
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| 23 Nov 2008 10:53 AM |
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90% running time - is that 22 hours per day or just 90% of the time after dark?
90% running time could be appropriate for 16 degree outdoor air temp...or not...depends on design temp, which depends on where you are located. You mentioned snow, so I gather you're not anywhere near me in Florida.
Higher than normal run time could be related to incomplete burial of ground loop.
A floor intake is helpful but often not sufficient to deal with what may be stratification (warm air stuck up high) in a high room. Can you tell us how warm it is near the ceiling in the living room? If it is warm up there possible fixes may include redirecting that room's registers to throw air downward or a slow turning ceiling fan to gently push that warm air down.
Regarding ceiling fans, I favor the "Gossamer Wind" models sometimes available through HoDepot - they are the only ones employing a highly-engineered blade design providing substantially higher CFM / Watt. Some think them ugly, though. At least use Energy-Star rated models.
It is also possible that the high room is simply undersupplied with warm air. In an ideal world all HVAC jobs include and comply with ACCA Manual D design calculations, which determine how much air each room requires.
Take care that in correcting the high room problem you don't create drafts - possible to fix the temperature problem but still be uncomfortable...
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Curt Kinder <br><br>
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 23 Nov 2008 12:16 PM |
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If you mean air intake when referring to heat runs, there is one. If it is a register, also one. If not, I don't know what a heat run is. The tray is hard plastic. We actually put a 1/2 inch peice of foam in between the unit and the tray with some results. |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 23 Nov 2008 12:20 PM |
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90% means running almost constantly. I understand it would run from the time I turn the thermostat up (one degree at a time) until the requested temperature is reached. After dark I'm not sure about....the one point we were recording at about 7pm, it ran then stopped for 5 minutes, ran again. I turned the temp down from 70 to 67 for overnight, and I know it did not run constantly. I am in Fayetteville WV where we got an unusual (for NOvember) 8 inches of snow on Tuesday and another 2 on Friday...it has been very cold and the trenches were dug on Thursday in temps between 10-25 degrees and are filled in about 3/4 now...my husband will finish today with our heatwave of 40....we do have a slow turning ceiling fan in living room. |
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Palace Geothermal
 Veteran Member
 Posts:1609
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| 23 Nov 2008 12:42 PM |
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Posted By macalata on 11/23/2008 12:16 PM If you mean air intake when referring to heat runs, there is one. If it is a register, also one. If not, I don't know what a heat run is. The tray is hard plastic. We actually put a 1/2 inch peice of foam in between the unit and the tray with some results. A heat run is a register that supplies heat. So there is only one supplying heat in your big room?
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Dewayne Dean <br>www.PalaceGeothermal.com<br>Why settle for 90% when you can have 400%<br>We heat and cool with dirt!<br>visit- http://welserver.com/WEL0114/- to see my system |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 23 Nov 2008 01:16 PM |
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Yep, and now I see what you're getting at. We should have another one. Wonder how easy that is to do if you are a DIY |
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 24 Nov 2008 05:07 PM |
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Update! Since yesterday (48 hours into the system running,) it began shutting down about 50% of the time, assuaging my fears about a non stop running. I emailed my installer about the lack of pads underneath and said that the gray tray is an air pad but will bring cork/rubber pads to put underneath next week. Great. He also said that the compressor shipping clips were not removed and that they didn't matter. So, my next question is, how do I remove those clips and where would they be? It is a waterfurnace premier geo cube....thanks for any help. |
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engineer
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2749
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| 24 Nov 2008 05:27 PM |
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Shipping clips sure as heck made a huge difference on my WF Envision. My installer left them on and I about panicked thinking we were going to have to live with the roaring and shaking until the end of time in our new dream home. They call 'em "shipping clips" because they are to be removed when the shipping part is over!
Compressor is almost certainly bolted to floor of unit and the mounts include thick rubber isolation bushings. These allow the compressor to move a bit while it starts and runs, and reduce noise and vibration. I imagine they allow the compressor to shift a bit in response to thermal expansion / contraction of connected piping. Shipping clips restrain the compressor's movement to prevent shipping forces from damaging it or connected piping. If the compressor can't move on its bushings, it'll be loud and vibrate excessively.
Look for them (and a big label telling installer to remove them) near where compressor is bolted down. On my Envision unit, wiring panel is hinged and had to be swung away before I could view clips.
Be careful - potentially lethal voltages lurk within! |
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Curt Kinder <br><br>
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
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macalata
 New Member
 Posts:35
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| 24 Nov 2008 05:51 PM |
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I couldn't see anything inside but I could tell that the wiring panel was obstructing much of the view...it doesn't look hinged though. Nor did I see a label telling the installer to remove them. |
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engineer
 Veteran Member
 Posts:2749
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| 24 Nov 2008 06:59 PM |
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It's possible Premier units don't have them.
Panel hinging system may not be immediately obvious. |
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Curt Kinder <br><br>
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is - Winston Churchill <br><br><a href="http://www.greenersolutionsair.com">www.greenersolutionsair.com</a>
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