Kentucky is out to destroy roof top solar
Last Post 09 Oct 2018 10:32 PM by Dana1. 6 Replies.
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LieblerUser is Offline
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04 Mar 2018 02:06 AM
It is called HB227 it basically guts a very fair net metering law and allows for 1/3 payment for exported power from solar etc. I've sent the attached to the newspapers. What else can I do?

Attachment: HB227.pdf

arkie6User is Offline
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05 Mar 2018 01:58 AM
You can buy a battery bank and charge controller and go off-grid.

1/3 of the retail price of electricity is roughly the utility cost to produce it. The remaining 2/3 of the retail price pays for maintaining the infrastructure to distribute the electricity and some profit for the utility shareholders. If you are getting full retail value for power that you export and everyone else does that, who is going to pay for the electrical distribution equipment infrastructure to maintain the backup when your solar panels aren't producing power?


jonrUser is Offline
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05 Mar 2018 08:14 PM
The utilities can install solar at a much lower cost/watt-hour than residential. So it's smart to avoid price distortions that overly encourage the latter.


Dana1User is Offline
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05 Mar 2018 11:32 PM
Doesn't look like that bill is really going anywhere without major modifications:

https://www.courier-journal.com/story/tech/science/environment/2018/02/28/house-bill-227-solar-power-rejected-kentucky-house-representatives/380674002/

In the event that they pass a fairly un-diluted HB227...

Batteries are expensive, water heaters are cheap. If you're heating water with electricity it's not difficult or expensive to use the water heater as the power dump to avoid exports to the grid.

Kentucky's electricity markets are still substantially regulated, and guarantee the utilities a return on investment for power generation assets, putting them at an arguably unfair market advantage over distributed small-time generators. I'm not entirely sure if it's even legal under KY rules to add self-consumption controls to a home PV system, but it's probably legal. In regulated market utilities would generally prefer an export-all import-all scheme, charging you a markup for the use of the "grid" that consists of the bus bar between the import meter and the export meter, as is the case in some parts of Australia.

Cost per kwh measured at the primary winding at the solar farm's export transformer is pretty cheap, but nowhere near the full cost of delivering it to the load inside your home. In regulated markets where utilities are also guaranteed a rate of return on the distribution grid assets, they prefer the solar farm model that requires use of the grid, and higher grid capacity requirements than a widely distributed grid asset market that would lower the capacity requirements.

Utility regulation and utility market structures aren't simple, but the more widely distributed the generation assets are, the lower the grid capacity requirements become, and the higher the grid resilience. The rules on this are changing pretty rapidly. The recently released FERC Order 841 is widely seen as the first volley of distributed grid batteries large & small making peaking generators uneconomic and redundant, and maximizing the value of distributed solar (even when the battery isn't behind the exact same meter as the PV, though it could be.)

https://www.utilitydive.com/news/ferc-order-opens-floodgates-for-energy-storage-in-wholesale-markets/517326/


scottishjohnUser is Offline
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07 Oct 2018 08:44 AM
same in UK you only get production cost --average price to buy kw =£0.17--you get FIT (feed in tariff) up to 4kw array, used to be 0.41 in 2002 -now with drop in solar pv costs its 0.07.takes on average 7years to pay back installation if you include the RHI grant ,and that is paid over 6 years,so it still takes 7 years to start making money ,provided you dont, have to replace an invertor --so yes use it all if you can ,then its worth 0.17+0.07=£0.24--not sure its right time to buy battery system yet, still expensive for amount they can store.heating water is better done with soar thermal -thats a no brainer.PV is not good for resistive loads like water heaters


DilettanteUser is Offline
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09 Oct 2018 10:27 PM
Posted By scottishjohn on 07 Oct 2018 08:44 AM
same in UK you only get production cost --average price to buy kw =£0.17--you get FIT (feed in tariff) up to 4kw array, used to be 0.41 in 2002 -now with drop in solar pv costs its 0.07.takes on average 7years to pay back installation if you include the RHI grant ,and that is paid over 6 years,so it still takes 7 years to start making money ,provided you dont, have to replace an invertor --so yes use it all if you can ,then its worth 0.17+0.07=£0.24--not sure its right time to buy battery system yet, still expensive for amount they can store.heating water is better done with soar thermal -thats a no brainer.PV is not good for resistive loads like water heaters

Honestly, I don't think I'd consider going solar PV WITHOUT an on-premises battery system these days.

Yes, it's stacking cost on top of the array, pushing out the payback.

But basic grid-tie systems don't protect you if the grid goes down.  The safety equipment takes down your array when grid power goes down so that someone working on lines won't get blasted.


Dana1User is Offline
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09 Oct 2018 10:32 PM
Or, you could just pretend you live in a first-world country with first-world grid reliabilty... :-)

A $500 gas powered portable generator and an isolating switch to take it off the grid is a much cheaper way to get "backup", that you might only need once per decade.

When batteries get cheaper & smarter and regulations favor paying the battery owner to provide ancillary grid services it'll be a whole 'nuther equation.


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