aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 10 Sep 2009 12:54 PM |
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I will be adding a number of steel beams to my build. The fab shops around here do not seem to have the ability to put a permanent rust proof coating on my beams. I need to rust proof this metal, and a number of other metal components, such as the connections, posts, steel plates, etc. At the same time I don't want to use something chock full of harmful chemicals, and doesn't cost a mint. Can anyone PLEASE help me out here as I can find basically nothing on google. Thanks!
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Jelly
 Veteran Member
 Posts:1017
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| 10 Sep 2009 05:02 PM |
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Are they not galvanized to begin with? |
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cmkavala
 Veteran Member
 Posts:4327

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| 10 Sep 2009 05:49 PM |
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There are hot dipped galvanizing services and powder coat services that can handle large beams |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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cmkavala
 Veteran Member
 Posts:4327

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| 10 Sep 2009 05:53 PM |
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you can also get galvanized steel box beams fabricated to carry large spans by www.metwood.com
metwood beams are also user friendly with wood framing as well as steel framing |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 10 Sep 2009 06:40 PM |
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Posted By cmkavala on 09/10/2009 5:53 PM you can also get galvanized steel box beams fabricated to carry large spans by www.metwood.com
metwood beams are also user friendly with wood framing as well as steel framing
I have seen the Metwood beams before in an article that I read, the guys said it was actually heavier than the same beam would have been in LVL, but it could do the job in a smaller dimension. The filled it with foam too, which was a great idea. I like that it is galvanized, the only problem that I see with these is that they said they are also quite expensive, and the only reason they chose it was because the LVL would have been too deep.
I suppose maybe I could give them a shot still and ask a price, the steel fabs I have in town are giving me a good price though, (I think) 10w17 H beams, and 3 sets of posts, about 70 feet of H beam in that dimension for about 2200 bucks w/ the posts. Now, headroom is a critical thing here, I don't want to loose too much headroom removing the walls I want to take out, hence why I chose steel. 8w40 would have worked too, but that's 40 blasted pounds a foot, they would have weighed way too much for us to move around.
the powder coats I don't really know much about, but I didn't think they really held up all that well. I wanted to build this place so that it stands for at least 100 years easy, and that would mean rust proofing the crap out of these with some high quality stuff. I know there is a black enamel that I saw on the beam in my friend's grandpa's basement, but I don't know where to find that stuff. I need a high quality coating, I thought about using a basement waterproofing product that had rubber in it, but I wasn't sure if that would be smart. |
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cmkavala
 Veteran Member
 Posts:4327

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| 10 Sep 2009 06:49 PM |
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If height is critical, the H beam is probably the best, your supplier can help size it, you will need to give them the span and load. Red oxide primer and any good paint intended for steel will probably last well over a 100 years. |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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Opus 
 New Member
 Posts:68
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| 10 Sep 2009 07:37 PM |
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I use Sherwin Williams Macro Poxy 646. They also have an excellent water based acrylic primer. I think it is Acryl Pro. These are on their website under industrial and marine coatings. |
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aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 10 Sep 2009 07:45 PM |
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Posted By Opus on 09/10/2009 7:37 PM I use Sherwin Williams Macro Poxy 646. They also have an excellent water based acrylic primer. I think it is Acryl Pro. These are on their website under industrial and marine coatings.
Oh interesting, I'll have to check that out, a simple paint would be easy if it held up well enough.
I was going to use a fairly versatile product, one that I might use on my basement waterproofing (it's fairly expensive for how much I need to do that though) it's called Ames Bluemax, it's a rubber based coating that is potable water safe, so I liked that it has no VOCs in it at all, but I wasn't sure how well it would work. I think I will try one of those two options though. |
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aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 10 Sep 2009 07:46 PM |
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Posted By cmkavala on 09/10/2009 6:49 PM If height is critical, the H beam is probably the best, your supplier can help size it, you will need to give them the span and load. Red oxide primer and any good paint intended for steel will probably last well over a 100 years.
I think I can get them to put the red oxide primer on, the did on one of the beams that I already got, but that particular beam was cleaned up with xylene and reprimed though, it's still got a few touches of rust on it already. If I were to just paint over with that sherwin paint, or a rubber waterproofing would that halt the formation of rust that has already started? |
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cmkavala
 Veteran Member
 Posts:4327

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| 10 Sep 2009 07:58 PM |
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read the can and see if its made for that purpose |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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Opus 
 New Member
 Posts:68
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| 11 Sep 2009 12:35 AM |
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Blue max is a great product but I don't think I would use it for that purpose. It must be protcted from UV and is quite sticky for a long time. MacroPoxy is not cheap. Get an account with SW and save about 25%. Macropoxy:
http://protective.sherwin-williams.com/detail.jsp?A=sku-26175%3Aproduct-6843 .
It is not VOC free. Epoxy stinks. Proper prep is always important. I sand blast but the MacroPoxy lit says it can go over marginally prepared steel. Steel from the supplier can come with a primer on it is often painted over surface rust. Epoxy needs to be protected from UV also with a top coat of some kind. You could also use Pro-Cryl as a Primer:
http://www.paintdocs.com/webmsds/webPDF.jsp?SITEID=STORECAT&doctype=PDS&lang=E&prodno=B66W310 .
It is an acrylic. I top coat with Sher-Cryl:
http://www.paintdocs.com/webmsds/webPDF.jsp?SITEID=STORECAT&doctype=PDS&lang=E&prodno=B66W300
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aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 11 Sep 2009 08:03 AM |
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Posted By Opus on 09/11/2009 12:35 AM Blue max is a great product but I don't think I would use it for that purpose. It must be protcted from UV and is quite sticky for a long time. MacroPoxy is not cheap. Get an account with SW and save about 25%. Macropoxy:
http://protective.sherwin-williams.com/detail.jsp?A=sku-26175%3Aproduct-6843 .
It is not VOC free. Epoxy stinks. Proper prep is always important. I sand blast but the MacroPoxy lit says it can go over marginally prepared steel. Steel from the supplier can come with a primer on it is often painted over surface rust. Epoxy needs to be protected from UV also with a top coat of some kind. You could also use Pro-Cryl as a Primer:
http://www.paintdocs.com/webmsds/webPDF.jsp?SITEID=STORECAT&doctype=PDS〈=E&prodno=B66W310 .
It is an acrylic. I top coat with Sher-Cryl:
http://www.paintdocs.com/webmsds/webPDF.jsp?SITEID=STORECAT&doctype=PDS〈=E&prodno=B66W300
Well these beams are going to be inside the house, they are not going to be seeing sunlight. I don't like the VOC content of all the epoxies I've seen out there, they are all like 30% VOCs by weight, yikes! I don't much like the petroleum waxes, because that's just a bunch of petroleum too, which is in essence another form of VOCs once they break down a bit and become airborne. sigh. Does rust stop if you seal it in airtight? If it does, the bluemax should work fine for that purpose, and I thought the rubbery pliable coating would be a good thing, something that got brittle over time would be a negative as it might flake off.
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aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 11 Sep 2009 10:26 AM |
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I found these two places as well, but as I'm wading through all their products I'm not quite sure what I should use, haha.
http://www.theruststore.com/Rust-FAQs-W51C2.aspx
http://www.kbs-coatings.com/KBS-Videos_ep_90-1.html
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Opus 
 New Member
 Posts:68
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| 12 Sep 2009 01:40 PM |
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Are your beams going to be completly coveredwith other materials? If not they will see sunlight unless you have no windows. You must not have read the link to the Macropoxy info or you would see it is low VOC. Rust will continue as long as water vapor and oxygen can reach the steel. What looks airtight and what acutally is a complete barrier are two different things. Bluemax in neoprene which will not last as long as epoxy. If any light gets to it it will harden and crack. Sherwin Williams is one of the best as far as research and technology go. They spend a fourtune creating products that work for industry. There are other coating manufactures of course. My point is they KNOW what works and what doesn't. If water based neoprene coatings (Blue Max) would stop rust companies would be selling it for that purpose. If you put it on your steel and get rust you will never get it off. I have found nothing that removes it from tools. Do your homework and read the information of sites like Sherwin Williams. Don't asume that all epoxy is 30% VOC. Somebody has gone to great lengths to figure out what you want to know and created products just for what you want to do. I call them up and talk to an engineer when I hae a special situation. Most companies hae good product support. Use it. |
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aeridyne
 New Member
 Posts:60
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| 13 Sep 2009 01:51 PM |
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Hmm, ok I didn't check out the Macropoxy stuff, I'll have to look into that in a bit here, Sunday so they I imagine can't answer questions right now. I suppose you are right about the rubber coating potentially working, if it did it's likely somone would sell it that way. I couldn't find any actual numbers for VOC content on the website, guess I'd have to see the MSDS sheet.
Looks like it should go on a clean rust free surface, I have a lot of plates and such I need to coat as well that are already laden with rust so I'm looking for something that can work on those too, preffeably being able to just clean it up a minor bit and paint over. I know I could sand them off or something like that but it would be vastly easier to be able to just give it a quick wire brushing and paint it. |
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