I am getting ready to build the home in which I intend to reside for the rest of my life, and I really want it to be energy efficient, but also lovely. Cost is an issue but I'd rather have concrete walls than expensive doorknobs, ya know? I currently have a SCIP quote for $72000 and an AAC quote for $20k. The difference is somewhat staggering. On the other hand, the SCIP is virtually finished while the AAC would require more trade work. Any advice?

Where are you building? Hot, cold or in between??

Georgia. Not often cold. Pretty hot and humid in summer.

Can you get a local builder to help you finalize the cost for both ways so you will know the total cost before you make your decision.  Feel free to e-mail me if you want to discuss the quotes or anything else with building your home.

Posted By cathsand on 30 Jan 2012 10:00 PM
I am getting ready to build the home in which I intend to reside for the rest of my life, and I really want it to be energy efficient, but also lovely. Cost is an issue but I'd rather have concrete walls than expensive doorknobs, ya know? I currently have a SCIP quote for $72000 and an AAC quote for $20k. The difference is somewhat staggering. On the other hand, the SCIP is virtually finished while the AAC would require more trade work. Any advice?

Did you get a quote for ICF?

When you break down the various trades and buildup layers needed, how do they compare? SCIP skips a couple trades, no? In order to compare apples to apples it would be interesting to see the comparison then to get the building envelope to the same stage.

I'd think you might want to consider metal sips as well. Seems like a better availability of those in the SE.

How does the SCIP quote break down for panel cost/erection labor/shotcrete costs?

I have a signed contract with a local builder, but there is a clear understanding that we have not finalized the structural plans for the house. He is a good guy, but pretty traditional. For example he is very resistant to the idea of an insulated slab. I have pretty much acceded to no insulation, even though about half the house will be right on the slab with stained and polished concrete. I know I am going to have to be pretty hands on with the whole project, to keep these guys researching the stuff I want in this house! For example the HVAC guy has suggested a 5 ton system, which I know is too much for a well insulated, tight home like a SCIP or AAC. The ranch-style house is 2800 heated sq feet with about half that on slab and the other half on a walkout basement.

I am interested in metal sips, especially for the roof. But SIPS don't appear to skip any trades, and my cost outlay would surely be greater for the whole house. Anyone know of a contractor that builds with metal sips in Georgia?

The AAC quote is low because of the plant closing in Adel. I think the guy wants to get rid of product. But my trades estimates would all go up to deal with the material. SCIP seems so much easier to plumb and wire. I honestly just wish I could get the SCIPs for a bit less!

The SCIP guy did not break down the quote at all with regard to material/labor/travel, etc. He just priced the whole thing at $15 per sq ft of envelope.

Yes we are state licensed contractors in Georgia, Florida and Louisiana. We build exclusively with steel SIPs.
SIPs skip many trades and in particular, metal SIPs also eliminate the need for soffit and facia.

Just feeling my way.... If your scip guy wants $15/sf then you have 5000 square feet of wall, or a price of $4/sf for AAC, which is either unbelievable if it includes labor or not quite distress pricing if it is block alone. I had two quotes for AAC two years ago, from Aercon in Fla and Xella, formerly of Adel, Ga. Both were well under $3 after paying for two semi deliveries in Pa. That was mostly 8 inch block, but I don't I don't think I paid $4/sf for 12 inch block even 1,000 miles away. Typically for AAC you would add a $ or 2 for steel and concrete and $5 to $6 for labor for a price of $10/sf give or take. Stucco would be another $4 to $5 a foot. (I paid $4.50 installed, again after shipping from Hawkinsville, Ga.) Plastering was 75 cents/sf plus labor. I figure I am all in at about $13/sf as an combination owner builder and helper to moonlighting trades.

Wiring and plumbing in AAC isn't as big a deal as you might think. Two cuts with a circular saw; break out the channel with a wood chisel; foam it; trowel on plaster.

Both AAC and SCIP will pass code in most states without drywall. AAC, which has a fire rating of four hours, is used for fire walls in coal mines. But the missus may have a different view. No matter what the SCIP guy is telling you, the drywall on interior stud walls won't look anything like the SCIP wall around the corner unless you skim coat plaster over both.

Wow, stucco alone is $4-$5?? The SCIP quote includes stucco exterior and plaster interior. I dont want a stucco face on my craftsman home. Thinking of cultured stone or even stamped concrete to look like stone in front with stucco around the sides and back. I know the plaster will look different unless I plaster my Drywall, but I figure I'll live with it. I can always retroactively plaster my interior walls if I feel it is necessary. On that note, anyone have a good alternative to drywall?
What about SCIP walls and sip floor and ceiling? Could they work together?
Chris where does the plumbing and wiring go in a steel sip?

Oops, darn my iPad. Sorry that posted 3 times!
And Todd, the AAC quote includes labor. I think mostly panels rather than block tho. And I don't have to worry about "the missus".

Only the administrator can delete a post.  The best we can do is to edit the post down to a blank or down to something like "Intentionally Left Blank" or "Double Post".  I think some double postings occur because no immediate action happens after clicking the Submit button.

Posted By Alton on 31 Jan 2012 08:55 PM
Only the administrator can delete a post.  The best we can do is to edit the post down to a blank or down to something like "Intentionally Left Blank" or "Double Post".  I think some double postings occur because no immediate action happens after clicking the Submit button.

hit the alert button and ask admin to delete

I think SCIP walls, floor and ceiling would be ideal.  Of course, you could use different colors and textures for the walls, floor and ceiling.  Pex tubes or electrical lines could be buried in the thin shotcrete floor.  In our climate, thin mass would be more responsive for the cold mornings with warm afternoons.

If you are thinking of installng stone, then look at the Suretouch system.  See http://www.suretouchusa.com/   I have seen it but do not know the cost.  Looks great.

I was thinking of something like this
http://www.butterfieldcolor.com/products/vertical%20materials/vertical_stamping_tools.html

Posted By cathsand on 31 Jan 2012 09:58 PM
I was thinking of something like this
http://www.butterfieldcolor.com/products/vertical%20materials/vertical_stamping_tools.html

There are several stamps on this page.  Which of the five patterns did you like?

I like the top stone wall. Flex C Ment also has some nice ones. Envirolast links to them, so I'd think it'd be doable, perhaps as part of the scip process.

In defense of stucco subs everywhere, a half inch of traditional stucco on your house would weigh 15 tons dry. The stucco guy is applying it wet. With a trowel. The promise of scips is moving interior and exterior finish work into the factory.

Still missing facts on the AAC. Panels typically are hung on framework like a curtain wall. Siding essentially. Depending on how the structure is designed you could be looking at a conventional build inside.

Posted By cathsand on 31 Jan 2012 10:59 PM
I like the top stone wall. Flex C Ment also has some nice ones. Envirolast links to them, so I'd think it'd be doable, perhaps as part of the scip process.

I suspect that adding the rock appearance requires more skill than normally associated with shotcreting.  It may require a separate step and process.  If so, then the cost will increase.  However, I think the total cost would be less than adding concrete stone or real stone to shotcrete walls.

Posted By Alton on 01 Feb 2012 07:21 PM

Posted By cathsand on 31 Jan 2012 10:59 PM
I like the top stone wall. Flex C Ment also has some nice ones. Envirolast links to them, so I'd think it'd be doable, perhaps as part of the scip process.

I suspect that adding the rock appearance requires more skill than normally associated with shotcreting.  It may require a separate step and process.  If so, then the cost will increase.  However, I think the total cost would be less than adding concrete stone or real stone to shotcrete walls.

Maybe its doable BUT if you have stamped concrete then you know that you lay the mat down and stamp it with a tool. Easy when its all horizontal plane plus you have the ability to add retarder to the equation. To do walls I think you will need two people holding the mat and one person stamping. You could not use multiple mats. Each would have to be repositioned and than worked. Could be done but for sure you would not keep up with the shooter.