Have any of you guys used this product as a parge coat? http://styro.net/TuffIIFoamAndICFCoating.html The site states that it can be used below grade, which none of the synthetic stucco finishes ever state. They also sell it at the local Menard's.

Posted By jeepster on 10 Jun 2012 09:42 PM
Have any of you guys used this product as a parge coat? http://styro.net/TuffIIFoamAndICFCoating.html The site states that it can be used below grade, which none of the synthetic stucco finishes ever state. They also sell it at the local Menard's.

I used it nearly four years ago when I built my house. Here's a couple of threads with pics discussing it.

http://greenbuildingtalk.com/Forums/tabid/53/aff/4/aft/44303/afv/topic/afpgj/2/Default.aspx#30452

http://greenbuildingtalk.com/Forums/tabid/53/aff/4/aft/62986/afv/topic/afpgj/1/Default.aspx#45752

I sprayed mine on with a hopper sprayer because I've never done troweling of stucco and didn't want to learn on this. Some of the things to be aware of. It does not stick directly to foam, at least not while you're applying it. You must use the fiberglass mesh they have. The mesh sticks reasonably well to the foam. I haven't checked but the Tuff II maybe sticks to the foam over time. Spraying it on it does not fill voids. I had to fill in voids with a trowel and then spray over it. I see three or four cracks in it now, like maybe over a gap in the foam or on a corner. I'm not sure how abuse resistant it is. I have hit it a few times with a weed whacker without noticeable damage. The color has dulled from time and/or from sprinkler water hitting it.

I didn't run mine down below grade except a couple of inches or so. It does seem to be holding up well with dirt in contact with it.

It is pricey. That's one reason I didn't run it down farther although now I kind of wish I would have.

For me the Tuff II in conjunction with the Dow blue board was about the best solution I could come up that provided the following. A good rain shedding transition from Hardiplank siding to the the parging. A good water shedding transition from the parging to the dimple plastic. Relative ease of application without having troweling experience. And in the end it looks good, a lot better than concrete foundation normally seen below siding.

Any questions, shoot. I'll try to answer them.

I also used it to make ledges that went above fake stone work to keep rain water from going behind the stones. They're 2" blue board covered with Tuff II. The stone mason who mortared the stones in place for me said it was one of the best ledges he'd ever seen. Here's a pic.

Here's a pic of it after the siding was installed.

Did you Tyvex the entire home or just the door and window areas?

Posted By Lbear on 11 Jun 2012 03:53 AM
Did you Tyvex the entire home or just the door and window areas?

I built wood frames, double thick 2 x 6 with 1" foam in between, around the doors so I could use standard depth doors with them being flush on the inside. They're covered with Tyvek. I also used Tyvek on the wood frame gable ends. Used only peel & stick flashing around the windows.

Thanks dmaceld,

I only have to parge between my dimple board and the cultured stone, so I only need about 6" or so. I've seen some use roll stock aluminum. I'm not to keen on this, since I've seen aluminum degrade when in contact with soil. A lot of the products from STO or Dryvit state right on their containers "not for use below grade." So when I read that TUFF II allows it, I got excited.

I figured TUF II would stick well to foam, since it's advertised specifically for that use. Did you rasp the foam before coating it? I know you have to use the mesh, but I thought that was primary to strengthen the coating. I like the idea of the drywall hopper. I have to spray about 280 linear feet, and a hopper would probably make life easier.

A lot of the products from STO or Dryvit state right on their containers "not for use below grade."

I used the Sto BTS Plus last year on an 8" high section at/below ground level just before it got too cold to apply it anymore. Because the gutters aren't on yet, that parging sat in water with freezing for quite a few months. It only dried out a few weeks ago and it seems to be as good as the day it went in.. The salesperson specifically noted it wasn't approved for below grade, but he said it would work and it has, so far. I rasped the foam before the application, mostly to get a clean surface and I roughed up the slick surface of the peel and stick waterproofing membrane with 60 grit paper and it seems to be sticking there, as well.

Posted By ICFHybrid on 11 Jun 2012 07:57 PM

A lot of the products from STO or Dryvit state right on their containers "not for use below grade."

The salesperson specifically noted it wasn't approved for below grade, but he said it would work and it has, so far.

It's probably the same stuff, just Tuff II isn't marketing it as a stucco finish for a whole house, like the STO and Dryvit does.  I know that the Dryvit has had issues/lawsuits regarding water intrusion on wood-framed homes, but the cause was likely improper installation (i.e. allowing the foam and dryvit to extend below grade, which will wick moisture).

Did you get the STO in buckets or bags?

Posted By jeepster on 11 Jun 2012 03:53 PM
I figured TUF II would stick well to foam, since it's advertised specifically for that use. Did you rasp the foam before coating it? I know you have to use the mesh, but I thought that was primary to strengthen the coating. I like the idea of the drywall hopper. I have to spray about 280 linear feet, and a hopper would probably make life easier.

Maybe it did stick but I don't remember. I didn't rasp the foam and maybe I should have. I don't remember even cleaning it first unless it got dirt on it. Dow blue board has a thin plastic film on the printed side. Looking at the photos again I don't see any printing so either the back side has no film on it, which is the side I had out, or I peeled the film off. I now remember I did peel film off of Dow blue board for some part of the project. Maybe it was for the parging. Thinking more about it I'm inclined to think the Tuff II stuck to foam a lot better than it did to the plastic film.

I finally remembered what I did to the hopper gun to make it work better. I added a flexible kitchen sink drain pipe between the gun and hopper so I could keep the hopper fully upright when I needed to aim the gun up or down. That helped a lot to keep the Tuff II flowing into the hopper. It is thick stuff, and heavy. The only problem with spraying it on is goof ups can be a problem to repair. It's a bit of a challenge to blend repair spray into the existing spray without it showing.

Does Menards stock it, or just have it available special order? If they stock it then you don't need to be concerned about buying to much or too little. I had to order my through Lowes which took over a week, so running short would have been a problem. Because of that I may have skimped on some of the application.

If you decide to use a hopper gun, and don't already have one, I'll consider selling you mine. I probably won't ever use it again. However, they are relatively inexpensive and shipping cost may not make it worth buying mine.

Sto BTS Plus in bags. Seems like they were 21 kg bags, IIRC.

I bought a bucket from Home Depot on line to try it out.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/catalog/servlet/Search?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&keyword=tuff%20ii&Ns=None&Ntpr=1&Ntpc=1&selectedCatgry=SEARCH+ALL

It does stick directly to the foam. The fiber mesh is just for re-inforcement. I used another brand of fiber mesh (also from home depot on line) that was a non-stick version. It works just fine.

A bucket covers about 80 sqft, so it works out to just over $1 / sqft (with tax). Delivery is free (UPS).

It is a convenient product, especially for smaller projects. There is no mixing and it has a 2 year shelf life. I tested it with a trowel finish and was happy with the performance. It is a good idea to rasp with a wire brush, especially if your foam has any dirt or chalking on it. I plan on getting a little more to do some interior walls in my storms shelter.