FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 30 Aug 2018 02:53 AM |
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Hi guys, I've been interested in building a SIP house for years, and reading up, watching videos, and lurking here :) , but have some questions I haven't seen answered anywhere. I'm really sold on MGO SIP panels in particular and have 16 acres 45 min outside Orlando, FL we want to build on.
I'm not interested in arguing about steel, OSB, whatever, just looking at MGO in this post. So Id like to build the best house possible (obviously) using as little wood as possible. I understand the footer that the walls set on can be HPDE or some type of plastic lumber,
-Can the window/door sills etc also be made of that and meet code?
AC ducts, plumbing, electrical- So you just finished your MGO SIP shell, nice vaulted ceilings/roof. -
-Now where does all the HVAC duct work go?
-Can there be any plumbing in the exterior walls or does it have to run up through the slab just outside the wall or what?
-I've seen videos of running the electric and have run low voltage professionally years ago in my youth. Looks to be about 2x the work but doable, no problem.
-How do you mount the boxes in the MGO/foam solidly enough to; hang a ceiling fan in a SIP roof, resist 20+ yrs of ppl yanking cords out etc?
-What about mounting a big screen TV? Cabinets?
Roofs
-I assume MGO cant be used by code on the external side of the roof because of nail holding strength etc, so I've seen plywood/mgo and that's fine.
-What do manufactures suggest for a roof system? Sealed membrane or breathable?
I would spend the extra money and do barrel tile roof because they have a built in breathable air gap, but that's my layman internet opinion. Not interested in going cheap and trying to roll on some trailer seal every few years.
Manufacturer suggestions?
Exterior/Interior Finish
The plan is to use an acrylic spray on knock down stucco, preferably colored already. (again layman internet opnion)
-On the outside is that waterproof enough to be applied directly to the MGO with no extra vapor barrier or adhesive treatments? MGO will absorb water even through humidity from my understanding, does it need to breath?
-Whats the best external wall system thats not brick (easy/inexpensive/hurricane resistant)?
I really like vinyl siding because it goes together easy, has a breathable air gap, very water resistant, long life, choose your color, no painting/maintenance etc but is delicate to wind damage and can look cheap if done wrong.
Foundation
-Slab on grade or pier/pile foundation. Would a SIP house benefit from using 10" sip floors on a pier/pile foundation? I know the electricity and plumbing would be more accessible etc or am I over thinking it?. Costs?
Thanks for reading all this and I look forward to any replies/suggestions. FLMike |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 30 Aug 2018 10:24 AM |
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FLmike,
your suppliers FL Product Approval will tell you if you can use composite lumber or not
otherwise you would need to get it independently engineered
also you need to make sure the mfg is OK with it (in writing) or you could void the warranty |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 03 Sep 2018 05:23 AM |
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Thanks cmkavala, I'm really surprised there's not more replies from ppl who have built or even manufacturers of sips. It seems they would be great for getting an efficient shell up but the logistics for running all the wires, plumbing, and HVAC duct work would be a nightmare. I've never seen a SIP building in the semi finished stage with all that equipment installed. Maybe theres a reason  Is Innova still active on this forum? they are a local builder near me. |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 03 Sep 2018 11:59 AM |
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Posted By FLMike on 03 Sep 2018 05:23 AM
Thanks cmkavala,
I'm really surprised there's not more replies from ppl who have built or even manufacturers of sips.
It seems they would be great for getting an efficient shell up but the logistics for running all the wires, plumbing, and HVAC duct work would be a nightmare. I've never seen a SIP building in the semi finished stage with all that equipment installed. Maybe theres a reason
Is Innova still active on this forum? they are a local builder near me.
FLmike, there is no difference in the logistics of running the electrical and mechanicals than conventional, except if the system has chases (electricians hate those) I have hundreds of photos in the rough-in stage , some can be see at www.greensips.com I also have a customer in Leesburg , FL that is in the rough mechanical stage that would welcome anyone to visit his construction site Innova is actually a MFG not a builder |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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sipsresource
New Member
Posts:4
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| 05 Sep 2018 02:28 PM |
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FLMike,
Just a few thoughts;
MGO sips has it's place just as metal sips, they both work for certain designs and environments;based on your original post maybe you should consider a combination of both MGO and Metal !
I prefer OSB for ease of work-ability on-site and yes I have built with and manufactured the other panels as well, weight and size of panels are my concerns with MGO. Just keep this in mind when considering and designing a roof of any size using MGO panels, your cost will be considerable to support the load, especially if you lean towards true barrel tile roof. A membrane will work if you like the look and works with the design.
Technology has changed the way we build today as we all know and see, with the correct use and combination of technology OSB is my preferred panel material.
Wire chase design for wall panels is basically the same in the different panels, yes it can be a challenge at times in wiring but really even in a stick built home, issues arise! Roof panels can be designed and manufactured to accept lighting but generally it is best not to do this unless it is a thick panel, again if designed for that type of fixture during the manufacturing stage!
Enjoy your build!
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newbostonconst
Advanced Member
Posts:736
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| 06 Sep 2018 12:26 PM |
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So if you don't put lighting in the ceiling....do you bounce lights off the ceiling from fixtures mounted on the walls? I know you don't use table lamps.....
Tried searching but came up with nothing. |
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| "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience." George Carlins |
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DavidBrownEnterprises
New Member
Posts:25
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| 06 Sep 2018 01:26 PM |
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Hi FLMike. Our company installs SIP house packages in Florida. We primarily use the steel SIPS for so many reasons. In a house with vaulted ceilings, you have to account for dropped ceilings in strategic places to accommodate air conditioning ductwork, and some light fixtures. In most of the houses that we build, the ceilings are dropped over the kitchen, hallways and bathrooms. Of course the layout of the floor plan is important in these considerations. For rooms with vaulted ceilings, we will have a wire chase built into the panel at the specific location for ceiling fans, or other hanging light fixtures. All of the vaulted ceilings and interior SIP walls have 1 1/2" hat channel attached to them before the drywall is installed. So for the interior walls, the low-profile electrical boxes can be used for the wall plugs, cable and telephone wiring.
For the window and door openings, we install steel or aluminum channel on the cut edge of the panel opening before installing the doors or windows.
Although we only build with steel SIPS, I think my answers to some of your questions are applicable to the MGO SIP panels too. |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 08 Sep 2018 02:17 PM |
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Thanks guys that answers some questions.
I understand what you mean by engineering the hvac ele, and plumbing around using sips and get creative to run the duck work etc, i guess you cant really put a toilet or sink on an outer wall with out the plumbing coming out of the floor or something.
The reason I was leaning towards MGO SIPs was to reduce time expense and labor because I "think" you can just seal the seams and do a primer and flexible colored acrylic stucco for both the interior and exterior. With most any other wall you will need a vapor barrier, insulation, furring, and some sort of expensive siding or drywall over the SIP/Framing.
If that is true I would want to have engineered ele boxes in the vaulted ceiling SIP. I understand they cut the chase and even prerun the wire, but how does the box mount and support a fan, hanging light fixture etc. with no studs?
Regarding the roof, my understanding is MGO and steel are not rated for pull out strength and thats why they use OBS or ply MGO roofs? Is that true?
CMKAVALA I checked out your site and saw some pics of utilities ran in the ceiling. My property is in Leesburg and I will be up there in the next few weeks, can you PM some info on looking at that house? Thx!
Thanks guys you definitely answered some questions, and now I have more lol. |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 08 Sep 2018 03:01 PM |
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Posted By FLMike on 08 Sep 2018 02:17 PM
Thanks guys that answers some questions.
I understand what you mean by engineering the hvac ele, and plumbing around using sips and get creative to run the duck work etc, i guess you cant really put a toilet or sink on an outer wall with out the plumbing coming out of the floor or something.
The reason I was leaning towards MGO SIPs was to reduce time expense and labor because I "think" you can just seal the seams and do a primer and flexible colored acrylic stucco for both the interior and exterior. With most any other wall you will need a vapor barrier, insulation, furring, and some sort of expensive siding or drywall over the SIP/Framing.
If that is true I would want to have engineered ele boxes in the vaulted ceiling SIP. I understand they cut the chase and even prerun the wire, but how does the box mount and support a fan, hanging light fixture etc. with no studs?
Regarding the roof, my understanding is MGO and steel are not rated for pull out strength and thats why they use OBS or ply MGO roofs? Is that true?
CMKAVALA I checked out your site and saw some pics of utilities ran in the ceiling. My property is in Leesburg and I will be up there in the next few weeks, can you PM some info on looking at that house? Thx!
Thanks guys you definitely answered some questions, and now I have more lol.
FLmike, You can put toilets and sinks on exterior walls, normally the toilet is thru the floor anyway , as well as showers and tub drains, sink drains and waterlines can be cut into the SIP wall, but why make it tough on yourself if you don't need to? easier to stub thru the floor IMHO, screws do have pull out ratings for steel skins and I would add they are consistent because the skin is uniformly made unlike wood chips glues and pressed together furring out walls and ceilings is a better way to run electric wiring and it is always accessible just below the drywall any panel that uses chases prohibits your from ever adding or alterating the electrical in the future , it is literally buried in the panel, electricians hate the chases and liken them to doing a remodeling job fishing thru the walls electrical inspectors are not fond either because they cannot see the work on rough in , there's no way to guarantee that the wire was not spliced in the wall because its not visible. steel SIPs are the vapor barrier and you can applied coatings like stuc-o-flex directly to the skin MGO is at least twice the weight , limited in length, OSB (termites need I say more?) |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 08 Sep 2018 06:18 PM |
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Posted By FLMike on 08 Sep 2018 02:17 PM
Thanks guys that answers some questions.
I understand what you mean by engineering the hvac ele, and plumbing around using sips and get creative to run the duck work etc, i guess you cant really put a toilet or sink on an outer wall with out the plumbing coming out of the floor or something.
The reason I was leaning towards MGO SIPs was to reduce time expense and labor because I "think" you can just seal the seams and do a primer and flexible colored acrylic stucco for both the interior and exterior. With most any other wall you will need a vapor barrier, insulation, furring, and some sort of expensive siding or drywall over the SIP/Framing.
If that is true I would want to have engineered ele boxes in the vaulted ceiling SIP. I understand they cut the chase and even prerun the wire, but how does the box mount and support a fan, hanging light fixture etc. with no studs?
Regarding the roof, my understanding is MGO and steel are not rated for pull out strength and thats why they use OBS or ply MGO roofs? Is that true?
CMKAVALA I checked out your site and saw some pics of utilities ran in the ceiling. My property is in Leesburg and I will be up there in the next few weeks, can you PM some info on looking at that house? Thx!
Thanks guys you definitely answered some questions, and now I have more lol.
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 25 Sep 2018 10:53 AM |
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yes MGO is waterproof and yes it will breath as well as any coating you apply to it--but if its a real SIP panel ,not stick and foam infill,the moisture won,t go anywhere anyway as the pir /pur / eps foam is also bug and waterproof .
you want std type roofing just use tile battens attached to mgo with ring nails and continue as normal |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 25 Sep 2018 10:55 AM |
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In uk alot of MGO sip panelled house finish with "slip brick" just cemented direct to MGO panels --basically a brick but only 7Mm or 10MM thick 3/8" to you--so it looks like a brick house |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 25 Sep 2018 12:47 PM |
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That looks like a good product, but is MGO really waterproof, or just not affected by moisture much? If we used a acrylic stucco that will truly waterproof the mgo, but its not breathable and if water gets behind there somehow it would be hard to dryout. The brick would wick water in and usually required an airgap behind to insulate and dry out, if in direct contact with the mgo i imagine it would'nt wick into the mgo? |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 25 Sep 2018 01:27 PM |
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nope mgo is waterproof and in florida you have no frost ----we have frost and it is no problem . you even use mgo sips for basement construction in the USA -
bottom line is the better you insulate your house the cheaper it is to heat or cool it --outside influences are minimal building code in scotland now is 140mm of pur foam minmum,
buld a sip house and wether you want it hot or cold it will be cheap to do -compared to anything else --presuming you can stop your wife from opening the windows and use a balanced heat/cold recovery ventilation system
If you did it ICF the foam insulation both sides of the concrete will insulate you from outside just as well --so maybe better choice for hurricane zone-not termite problem either -std in uk is 70mm both side of concrete |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 25 Sep 2018 01:29 PM |
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mgo /cement panels is what they use in tropical countries because of no insect problem even with high humdiity --and there you want air con all the time |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 25 Sep 2018 06:13 PM |
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scottish john
,found the exact opposite to be true.....this is from the James Hardie website ........"There are no approved governing criteria for MgO/MgCl exterior products (used primarily for soffi t, panel, trim and siding) with ICC-ES. Therefore, MgO/MgCl
exterior products are not code approved.
CONFUSING CLAIMS
Some MgO/MgCl material suppliers indicate that their products have passed certain ASTM International (formerly known as the American Society for Testing
and Materials) tests. An examination of the claims shows that some of the tests apply to other product categories or functions (for example, assessed for
interior application but recommended for external use) while important tests for quality and application suitability, including moisture resistance, are lacking
"
it has been my own personal experience that MGO absorbs water and when it reaches maximum saturation point then leaches out
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 25 Sep 2018 06:15 PM |
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>
scottish john
,this is from the James Hardie website ........"There are no approved governing criteria for MgO/MgCl exterior products (used primarily for soffi t, panel, trim and siding) with ICC-ES. Therefore, MgO/MgCl
exterior products are not code approved.
CONFUSING CLAIMS
Some MgO/MgCl material suppliers indicate that their products have passed certain ASTM International (formerly known as the American Society for Testing
and Materials) tests. An examination of the claims shows that some of the tests apply to other product categories or functions (for example, assessed for
interior application but recommended for external use) while important tests for quality and application suitability, including moisture resistance, are lacking
"
it has been my own personal experience that MGO absorbs water and when it reaches maximum saturation point then leaches out
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 25 Sep 2018 07:49 PM |
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Chris, that is technically correct but that sounds like they mean using MGO in the raw for siding etc. which doesn't sounds like a good idea. I imagine MGO board is approved for code as supplied in a wall sip as long as there is a coating over it like acrylic stucco. |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 25 Sep 2018 08:05 PM |
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Bottom line for me is if it looks like it will be too much trouble to get a sip house approved and built to code then i would do a stick frame and spray foam it before the drywall goes on. I'll have to talk directly to some manufacturers when I am closer to pulling the trigger i guess. |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 25 Sep 2018 08:09 PM |
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Mike,
My point is it's NOT waterproof |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 25 Sep 2018 08:13 PM |
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When I was contracting I did about 150 conventional homes and 150 SIP homes , SIPs are no more difficult to build or permit than any other house the end benefits are to the homeowner |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 26 Sep 2018 09:19 AM |
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neither are concrete blocks without another layer on them that why brick/block houses have a cavity wall --if you consider stucco to be a waterproof layer then that applies directly to MGo or cement board same as on block .I think we have much wetter climate in uk ,so if allowed here it must be ok for you in US .there are lots of videos showing mgo +treated osb basements in US -and they use same tanking methods as concrete and block below ground structures --
bottom line is mgo sips are far more waterproof than stick and slab insulation -alot stronger and always better insulated and alot quicker to build --3-4 days from finished foundations and its built wind and watertight with a 4 man crew --plenty on videos showing it happening
then the final thing is with the superior insulation and airtightness it will be the cheapest to heat or cool--
spray foam will need to be alot thicker to give R value as a sip panel house --and if sprayed after first fix and cabling not ducted there are some issues with cable overheating and degridation of plastic insulation over time ,if using basic type wiring cables,same goes for fitting cables into chanels in insulation ICF walls-bigger cabling should be used- or strap out and leave services gap before dry boards |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 26 Sep 2018 12:19 PM |
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Posted By scottishjohn on 26 Sep 2018 09:19 AM
neither are concrete blocks without another layer on them that why brick/block houses have a cavity wall --if you consider stucco to be a waterproof layer then that applies directly to MGo or cement board same as on block .I think we have much wetter climate in uk ,so if allowed here it must be ok for you in US .there are lots of videos showing mgo +treated osb basements in US -and they use same tanking methods as concrete and block below ground structures --
bottom line is mgo sips are far more waterproof than stick and slab insulation -alot stronger and always better insulated and alot quicker to build --3-4 days from finished foundations and its built wind and watertight with a 4 man crew --plenty on videos showing it happening
then the final thing is with the superior insulation and airtightness it will be the cheapest to heat or cool--
spray foam will need to be alot thicker to give R value as a sip panel house --and if sprayed after first fix and cabling not ducted there are some issues with cable overheating and degridation of plastic insulation over time ,if using basic type wiring cables,same goes for fitting cables into chanels in insulation ICF walls-bigger cabling should be used- or strap out and leave services gap before dry boards
Stucco is ABSOLUTELY NOT WATERPROOF! it is porous cement and works like a sieve. and is the reason the current code requires not one , but two water barriers behind the lath when applied over framing , block is not waterproof either , the only way to waterproof a stucco surface is to coat with several coats of elastomeric paint do you really want to rely on paint as your weather barrier? |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 26 Sep 2018 12:45 PM |
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Now im confused about this,as I live in a CBS constructed house with regular cement stucco over the CBS. I have drilled through to the interior several times for various projects, and there is no waterproof barrier, wire, styrofoam etc. There are hundreds of other housed built just like this in my neighborhood and I suspect millions in Florida alone. I have never had any issues with the walls and water intrusion and use normal brand name exterior paints.
Chris, I understand you sell or install steel sips, what do you suggest for exterior finishes on them? |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 26 Sep 2018 01:21 PM |
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Posted By FLMike on 26 Sep 2018 12:45 PM
Now im confused about this,as I live in a CBS constructed house with regular cement stucco over the CBS. I have drilled through to the interior several times for various projects, and there is no waterproof barrier, wire, styrofoam etc. There are hundreds of other housed built just like this in my neighborhood and I suspect millions in Florida alone. I have never had any issues with the walls and water intrusion and use normal brand name exterior paints.
Chris, I understand you sell or install steel sips, what do you suggest for exterior finishes on them?
FL mike, yes you are correct and the reasons why many Florida homes have mold or mildew issues, the block allows water vapor to pass thru the walls and in severe cases the like hurricane Charlie when the rain is coming sideways, the liquid water was pushed thru the stucco/block walls into the block core , where it slowly leached to the interior, with no electricity for weeks the interior became its own bio-sphere To address what can you put over steel SIPs: nothing!, the skins are waterproof or you can put anything as an aesthetic cladding there are no limits ............., stucco, synthetic stucco, stone ,brick, wood siding, vinyl siding, log siding , metal siding, Hardie siding, my own personal home has a combination of: stucco over paper backed wire lath, Hardie-Lap siding and cultured stone , but I have many customers that have left the exterior white or colored galvalume skins serve as the permanent exterior , including a Little Caesar's free standing restaurant in Louisiana You can go to this link to view projects with and without claddings Photo Gallery |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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FLMike
New Member
Posts:11
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| 26 Sep 2018 02:25 PM |
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"nothing!, the skins are waterproof" I had a feeling that would be your reply I'm going to email you because I have alot of steel sip questions. |
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Torben
Basic Member
Posts:216
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| 27 Sep 2018 01:04 AM |
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The individual panel skins are waterproof but joints and penetrations may not be. Proper flashing and layering of surfaces (to promote drainage away from an assembly) are still critical. |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 27 Sep 2018 01:38 AM |
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Posted By Torben on 27 Sep 2018 01:04 AM
The individual panel skins are waterproof but joints and penetrations may not be. Proper flashing and layering of surfaces (to promote drainage away from an assembly) are still critical.
true, if panels are to be left exposed seams must be sealed , panels have been tested in accordance with FM 4471, where they are placed under 6" of water head for 7 days with no leakage |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 27 Sep 2018 08:26 AM |
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cmkavala --how much cheaper are steel sips than osb --and what is outerskin thickness--are the skins plastisol coated or painted----I can find no one selling them in uk --only typical type commercial profiled panels for exterior cladding of portal steel frame "sheds" |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 27 Sep 2018 11:30 AM |
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Posted By scottishjohn on 27 Sep 2018 08:26 AM
cmkavala --how much cheaper are steel sips than osb --and what is outerskin thickness--are the skins plastisol coated or painted----I can find no one selling them in uk --only typical type commercial profiled panels for exterior cladding of portal steel frame "sheds"
scottisjoun, I Earlier on in my career I built with OSB and found too many issues with weight, water and moisture, once I did my first SSIP house , I stuck with it , the initial cost is about the same, but the benefits for SSIPs go beyond that *skins are the moisture barrier, * no cranes needed to set *no food value for carpenter ants or termites * no OSB off gassing *underside of roof panels create a finished white soffit or porch roof any manufacturer that makes cold storage panels are making metal panels, but you would need to verify that their panels are structural as metal panels are the most widely produce in the world , but take caution some are not structural I am not familiar with the UK companies , but I would search your area for cold storage manufacturers first , then verify they are structural as well. we also ship worldwide :) |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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scottishjohn
Basic Member
Posts:109
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| 27 Sep 2018 12:45 PM |
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I expect transport to uk port then up to scotland would be prohibitive--was hoping you would say you had a uk agent--just strange no one markets them here if they comply with uk codes ,
are they T+ or just edge to edge fitting
how much lighter than osb panel --both me and brother are about start a build ,but not young -anymore 72 +67 and with 50 years of manual motortrade wear +tear on the body .so weight is a concern |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4324
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| 27 Sep 2018 12:56 PM |
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Posted By scottishjohn on 27 Sep 2018 12:45 PM
I expect transport to uk port then up to scotland would be prohibitive--was hoping you would say you had a uk agent--just strange no one markets them here if they comply with uk codes ,
are they T+ or just edge to edge fitting
how much lighter than osb panel --both me and brother are about start a build ,but not young -anymore 72 +67 and with 50 years of manual motortrade wear +tear on the body .so weight is a concern
a 6" panel weighs 2.2 lbs. per square foot , I can easily maneuver a 10 ft panel myself I am 66 and just recently purchased a trailer frame to build a tiny house on wheels , I plan on doing everything by myself I plan on posting progress photos on GBT forum, but probably won't start until December when weather is cooler |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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Innova
Basic Member
Posts:121
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| 02 Jan 2019 01:27 PM |
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Hi Mike, please contact Innova Eco Building System in Miami, we can provide you with technical responses to all of your questions. The InnovaPanel product, an MGO SIPO has been approved by the State of Florida and Miami dade County since 2015. We have many completed homes in Florida, Caribbean and throughout South America. Innova uses only Florida approved MGO board that has been tested, third party certified and is under Florida's Product approval procedure. There are currently two different manufacturers of MGO Boards approved for Florida. We recommend "STucco Flex" for the exterior finish on our homes that desire a stucco finish. You can also use vinyl, wood or cement board siding, stone veneer or other. The Innova MGO SIP panel is unlike any other SIP on the market. Our panels are load bearing, more than 7000 pounds of axial loading per linear foot.The nail pullout on our HIP panels is a minimum of 900 psi, more than double the pullout strength of OSB or plywood. We have had 36 of our homes involved in 3 different documented natural disasters.Cat 5 Hurricane with 200 mph wind burst on St. Croix Island, ground zero in the Florida keys with CAT 4 hurricane Irma and an EF 2 Tornado in South Carolina, none of our homes received any structural damage or water intrusion into their homes. Their neighbors were not as lucky. Our product is impact rated, tested and NOA approved for the Coastal Impact Zone by Miami Dade County for +200 mph hurricane force winds.
We will be more than happy to provide technical responses to the remainder of your questions via email. We look forward to speaking to you soon. |
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Innova
Basic Member
Posts:121
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| 02 Jan 2019 04:05 PM |
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Hi Mike, please contact Innova Eco Building System in Miami, we can provide you with technical responses to all of your questions. The InnovaPanel product, an MGO SIPO has been approved by the State of Florida and Miami dade County since 2015. We have many completed homes in Florida, Caribbean and throughout South America. Innova uses only Florida approved MGO board that has been tested, third party certified and is under Florida's Product approval procedure. There are currently two different manufacturers of MGO Boards approved for Florida. We recommend "STucco Flex" for the exterior finish on our homes that desire a stucco finish. You can also use vinyl, wood or cement board siding, stone veneer or other. The Innova MGO SIP panel is unlike any other SIP on the market. Our panels are load bearing, more than 7000 pounds of axial loading per linear foot.The nail pullout on our HIP panels is a minimum of 900 psi, more than double the pullout strength of OSB or plywood. We have had 36 of our homes involved in 3 different documented natural disasters.Cat 5 Hurricane with 200 mph wind burst on St. Croix Island, ground zero in the Florida keys with CAT 4 hurricane Irma and an EF 2 Tornado in South Carolina, none of our homes received any structural damage or water intrusion into their homes. Their neighbors were not as lucky. Our product is impact rated, tested and NOA approved for the Coastal Impact Zone by Miami Dade County for +200 mph hurricane force winds.
We will be more than happy to provide technical responses to the remainder of your questions via email. We look forward to speaking to you soon. |
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Innova
Basic Member
Posts:121
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| 19 Jul 2019 01:37 PM |
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Hi Mike, since you are located in Florida, I would start by only using Florida Product Approved and Dade County Product approved products. For the SIP system, you can replace much of the wood with trex plastic lumber. You can also use an MGO floorplate which is approved with some SIP manufacturers. For plumbing installations, SIPS should be treated like a block wall. Most all plumbing will be installed in the interior framed partitions. For plumbing on exterior walls, most will be behind cabinets, for exposed walls you would fur them out like you would with block. The exterior plumbing, hose bibs is run exposed up the outside face of the house. The ac ductwork requires a little planning and the installation will vary with the design of the home. We generally frame the hallways and bath areas and run the duct down the hallway sidewall venting the rooms. Kitchen and dinning is sometimes sidewall vented from above the bath ceiling depending on layouts. Framed soffits can also be used. The goal is to keep the duct inside the conditioned space, not up in an attic so when the duct leaks, it is leaking into the conditioned space. For mounting electrical boxes, you use remodeling boxes which have ears on them for attaching to the face of the panel. If you send me your email I will send you an electrical guide which will shown this in more detail. All electrical should be coordinated with the SIP manufacturer but it is not an issue to add outlets and electrical later on with a SIP. I can you send you info on this as well. For ceiling fans, we use sidewall wall mounted boxes and we coordinate the locations with the splines in the timber roof panels. Our company has a product approved HZHV MGO roof panel. This roof panel is approved with a liquid applied roof system by Sherwin Williams (see forum on MGO Roof panels) for more information. For other roof systems we offer plywood or osb top skin with an MGO bottom skin. Our most common exterior finish is Stucco Flex. This is an amazing product that works well with MGO, does not crack and adds impact resistance. You can also use any common siding product on an MGO SIP. If you want vinyl siding, you seal the panel with Luxon concrete masonry sealer and then install the siding, no tyvek is required. In the Florida keys and other areas requiring elevated slabs, we use our approved MGO SIP floor panels. The panels provide a good R Value and are less than an elevated concrete slab. Most all other areas in florida are slabs on grade construction. If you use a SIP floor panel on a retaining wall with a crawl space, you will need to ensure you have at least 24" crawlspace and that the soil under the house is clean and drainable. The crawlspace ground should be several inches higher than the grade outside the crawlspace to prevent drainage under the house which could cause future moisture issues and other under the home. Please feel free to contact me with any additional questions about constructing with MGO SIPS. |
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YunionBoard
New Member
Posts:39
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| 30 Jul 2019 05:02 AM |
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Thanks a lot for sharing with us |
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Live Green With Yunion<br />
www.yunionboard.com<br />
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Innova
Basic Member
Posts:121
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| 16 Mar 2020 12:37 PM |
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Hi Florida Mike, Give us a call if you are still interested in building with MGO SIP in Orlando. We use composite lumber all the time with our system.Our SIPs are NOA approved for the high velocity coastal wind zones and Florida Product approved for all other areas. Depending on the design, we can show you how to lay out the ductwork for the ac system. As with all SIP houses in Florida regardless of the SIP skin, we recommend using a humidistat in lieu of a thermostat. We provide a complete electrical installation guide that will specify the type of receptacle boxes that we use for easy mounting with SIP. Ceiling fans use a side mount box and we coordinate the location with a roof spline which are much stronger than typical fan mounting in a conventional home. The MGO that we use for our system has over 350 psi nail pullout which is the same or more as most plywood and OSB sheets. Our axial loading is over 28,000 pound compressive load per panel, that is more than 7500 pounds a linear foot, the strongest load bearing SIP panel available on the market by far. We have 5 patents protecting our technology. We are the only manufacture that can produce 24' long MGO SIP panels without any thermal breaks. All other manufactures have to frame the panel (creates a hinge point of weakness) or can only produce 10' long MGO panels. Do not accept substitutes, no other MGO manufacture can produce panels like the InnovaPanel.There is a big difference between the InnovaPanel and the MGO SIPs that others are producing! We will be happy to answer all of your question in detail, just give us a call. We are located in Miami, Innova Eco Building System. We have installers working the Orlando area. |
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Innova
Basic Member
Posts:121
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| 18 Dec 2020 04:06 PM |
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Did you build your SIP home yet? |
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