All foam may be removed. Although, if you wanted to do that you would be using the wrong system. Regards

Posted By TexasICF on 19 Dec 2012 06:46 AM
All foam may be removed. Although, if you wanted to do that you would be using the wrong system. Regards

It would just be for a small section of a short hallway run to get in the ductwork/plumbing.

LBear, once the concrete has cured, the foam has no structural value, just insulation. You can remove at will to get your ducting in. I believe there was a discussion a few months back regarding running ducts and chases perpendicular to the forms, and even had some good pictures. I'll see if I can find it.

Does raduising the InsulDeck where it meets the wall assembly help prevent cracks? So instead of a sharp 90 degree angle, a curved radius is implemented into the InsulDeck by shaving the EPS with a blade.

Any time you put a sharp edge or corner into concrete it will be a focal point for cracks. It probably doesn't hurt to throw a little radius onto it, but the engineer should be involved in specifying that.

If you have any kind of fire potential under your ICF floor, like a kitchenette unit that might support a flash grease fire or something, you might want to consider putting some kind of screw into the top edge of the steel panel formers before the pour. They will be embedded in the floor skin and support the formers if the foam below gets melted for any reason.

Posted By Lbear on 22 Dec 2012 04:41 AM
Does raduising the InsulDeck where it meets the wall assembly help prevent cracks? So instead of a sharp 90 degree angle, a curved radius is implemented into the InsulDeck by shaving the EPS with a blade.

Every installer seems to have their own list of "tricks of the trade" a lot of guys will do some work with a folding saw at the wall to deck connection for a host of reasons. The typical amount of steel in the wall to deck connection makes it a pretty strong area. An engineer would be the best to give you an answer you can take to the bank though. Happy New Years!

Let's say on a 2nd story overhang/balcony that is utilizing InsulDeck (10" form) and the bottom portion is exposed to the outdoors. Above the InsulDeck balcony is conditioned living space. Since the form has only 2" of EPS on the I-Beam pocket portions, would that cause the concrete slab to begin to "bridge" the outside cold and carry it through the rest of the slab? Since the slab is one monolithic portion, can it potentially thermal bridge throughout the entire span?

Yes. That is correct. There is a relatively smaller cross section on the bottom portions of the ICF "joists", but concrete is tremendously conductive. The Insuldeck folks say that the thermal resistance of the 7+3 panels are overall R-16. That doesn't sound too bad, but you are talking about an entire floor area and the temperature differences can be substantial, particularly if you are using floor radiant and exposing them to outdoor ambient. Maybe the answer is another 2" of rigid foam sheet on the ceiling below.

Posted By ICFHybrid on 03 Jan 2013 01:00 AM
Yes. That is correct. There is a relatively smaller cross section on the bottom portions of the ICF "joists", but concrete is tremendously conductive. The Insuldeck folks say that the thermal resistance of the 7+3 panels are overall R-16. That doesn't sound too bad, but you are talking about an entire floor area and the temperature differences can be substantial, particularly if you are using floor radiant and exposing them to outdoor ambient. Maybe the answer is another 2" of rigid foam sheet on the ceiling below.

If one threw on another 1" or 2" of foam board. How would you install exterior grade drywall to the bottom of that 2nd floor InsulDeck?

If the overall R-Value of an exposed InsulDeck floor is R-16, an extra 2" of foam to the bottom of that would bring it to a R-23, just like the ICF wall.

So the panels can come in a 7+3 version or a 8+2 version?

No, that nomenclature is panel thickness + deck thickness (concrete slab over). The panels come in many thicknesses and you have a wide range of deck sizes you can pour over. All the "wing" foam depths are 2", however. The manufacturers have that information on their web sites, I am sure.

If you threw on 2" foam board, I figure you would get another R9-R10 out of it, so R25-R26. I suppose you could tack up the foam with some 2-1/2" or 3" screws and then use extra long drywall screws to go through everything when the rock goes up. Or, maybe some sort of wood ceiling would work for an outdoor location.

Posted By ICFHybrid on 03 Jan 2013 12:20 PM
No, that nomenclature is panel thickness + deck thickness (concrete slab over). The panels come in many thicknesses and you have a wide range of deck sizes you can pour over. All the "wing" foam depths are 2", however. The manufacturers have that information on their web sites, I am sure.

If you threw on 2" foam board, I figure you would get another R9-R10 out of it, so R25-R26. I suppose you could tack up the foam with some 2-1/2" or 3" screws and then use extra long drywall screws to go through everything when the rock goes up. Or, maybe some sort of wood ceiling would work for an outdoor location.

I guess one can also just stucco the underside of that 2nd floor overhang/balcony. Something like StuccoMax would provide the fire rating that exterior drywall would provide.

These foam panels look like they would work pretty good for the underside of a 2nd floor exterior InsulDeck application.

InSoFast

One could simply attach these panels to the underside of the InsulDeck and screw them in place to the steel InsulDeck attachment webs. A 2" panel would add another R-8 to the InsulDeck bottom side and bring it up to R-24 +/-.