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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 21 May 2008 11:40 AM |
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Eliminating the steel frame would save on cost, but I think it makes it much easier to construct. Erecting the steel frame would be simple and attaching the SIP panels would be easy enough.
One goal is to desing in such a way that a home owner could build the enevlope himself. The only piece that I would not feel comfortable with is the foundation. |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4327
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 21 May 2008 12:12 PM |
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SIP Companies That Are Interesting: -------------------------------------------------------- http://bigskyrcontrol.com/sips.asp <-- They have great load span information, but no pricing available. http://panelpros.com/ <-- More of a complete building system http://www.theSIPstore.com <-- smaller panels - up to 4x10 or 4x12, good information, per panel pricing is listed. http://sipsteamusa.com/index.html <-- Can provide raw panels, no pricing, not much info. http://www.r-control.com <-- No pricing, Good load documentation, 24' span x 4' Floor / Roof panels that use I-Beam or the like at joint. Plants all over USA. http://www.portersips.com/2007UPDATE/brochures.htm <-- Frame System With Sips, Based on 10' bays. http://greenwall.us/files/GreenWallInc_PriceList.pdf <-- GREAT PRICE LIST |
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 21 May 2008 12:34 PM |
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Chris -
What are the dimensions on that buiding? I am looking at 24x72 or 24x80. I would like to be able to span the 24' without any vertical supports.
My roof is just over 24' right now, the horizontal distance is 24' but it is slighly sloped, and I actually think I would like a small overhang (for aesthetics, not shade, shade will be done with a retractable awning), but that design can be changed.
If the floor SIPS can span the full 24' without any support, which some companies can, I might put in one support running the length of the building, parallel to the concrete north wall, 8' from the wall, maybe with a vertical support every 16' or 24'. The roof spans would then be 8'+ (from concrete wall to truss) and 16'+ from truss to South wall. But I would much rather deal with smaller panels and no crane.
Could you also quickly explain any difference in applying roofing and siding to metal SIPS to OSB sips.
Thanks,
Todd |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4327
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| 21 May 2008 02:13 PM |
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Todd;
the building is 28ft. x 44 ft. x 12ft. high, roof is a 3/12 pitch. Panels will span 24ft. depending on roof load , sometimes there is no advantage to using SIPs for the floor, and the floor load is usually much greater than a roof load they will not span 24ft. I do not know of any SIP cabable of spanning 24ft. of floor load
The difference in roof or wall clading is screws not nails |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4327
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| 21 May 2008 02:24 PM |
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Todd;
roof panels on that job were 16' - 6" and easily carried by two men |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 22 May 2008 11:21 AM |
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This home will be built in Connecticut.
An extensive green roof will add somewhere between 15 and 50 lbs / sf to the roof load.
The awning will be a steel structure supporting a canvas awning, attached to the building. |
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ReadyToRetire
Basic Member
Posts:212
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| 22 May 2008 02:04 PM |
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Todd,
Have you thought of making the crawl space conditioned -- you wouldn't need SIP floors then and then it would be a good area for your HVAC.
Larry
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4327
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| 22 May 2008 02:06 PM |
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Posted By tlynch on 05/22/2008 11:21 AM
This home will be built in Connecticut.
An extensive green roof will add somewhere between 15 and 50 lbs / sf to the roof load.
The awning will be a steel structure supporting a canvas awning, attached to the building. 15 -50 is a world of difference plus you need to calculate snow load too Your engineer will need to determine exactly what you requirements are |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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PanelCrafters
Advanced Member
Posts:680
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| 22 May 2008 02:46 PM |
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Posted By ReadyToRetire on 05/22/2008 2:04 PM
Todd,
Have you thought of making the crawl space conditioned -- you wouldn't need SIP floors then and then it would be a good area for your HVAC. Why have a crawl space at all? |
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| ....jc<br>If you're not building with OSB SIPS(or ICF's), why are you building? |
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 22 May 2008 02:52 PM |
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There are three options that is see for foundation:
1) Full Foundation with about 7' of headroom (I am 6'6" tall) - This is the most expensive but it would give me a workspace and lots of storage. Also, in the area this is considered the norm so it would help resale.
2) Crawl Space of about 2'6" - This would allow access to plumbing and electrical below the floor but provide no extra square footage.
3) Slab on Grade - cheapest by far, but very hard to repair plumbing and electrical.
What am I missing? |
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 22 May 2008 02:53 PM |
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Chris -
It all depends on what green roof system I choose, here is one for example:
http://www.liveroof.net/pg/System_Specifications
That system is roughly 30 lbs / sf. I don't plan on using a pre-bought system, as I have architects who have offered their services in designing, and building a green roof because they want the experience. So roof load will will be determined a little later.
Honestly, I know nothing about calculating roof loads, I will try to get this information as soon as possible.
Todd
More Green Roof Info:
http://www.hadj.net/green-roofs/project-info.html
Basic overview with lists of materials.
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GeorgiaTom
Basic Member
Posts:159
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| 22 May 2008 03:01 PM |
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sounds like a cave dweller to me |
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 22 May 2008 03:04 PM |
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Some sort of truss maight be needed to span the distance, this would add greatly to the cost... They would have to be on either 4' or 8' centers. Depedning on the system, and that means I would need 10 or 20 of them, So a system that could make the roof span would be excellent.
I would consider making the building narrower. |
 Attachment: section_w_truss.jpg
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 22 May 2008 03:10 PM |
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Tom -
One wall of the building will be 72' long and facing south with large windows, great view, down a hill and over a valley / river.
The entrance will be carved out of the berm wall so when you approace the house you will just see an 8' wide passage to a front door. This is sort of shown in one of the previous renderings. Hopefully when you enter the house it will be a great experience seeing this view opening up in front of you.
At least thats what I hope!
Todd |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4327
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PanelCrafters
Advanced Member
Posts:680
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| 23 May 2008 09:31 AM |
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Posted By tlynch on 05/22/2008 3:04 PM
Some sort of truss maight be needed to span the distance, this would add greatly to the cost... They would have to be on either 4' or 8' centers. Depedning on the system, and that means I would need 10 or 20 of them, So a system that could make the roof span would be excellent. Looking at the drawing, and the fact that you will have a Green roof, and the loads associated with it, I would probably forget SIPS altogether. A better solution, IMO, would be ICF's with a concrete(maybe hollow core) roof. No problem spanning front to back(even with the loads), and it wouldn't be that expensive. And, if you do go with Hollow Core, no trusses needed either. |
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| ....jc<br>If you're not building with OSB SIPS(or ICF's), why are you building? |
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tlynch
Basic Member
Posts:105
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| 23 May 2008 10:30 AM |
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And here I am in the SIPs forum...
Would it be possible to put a hollow core concrete roof on top of a SIPS Structure? Or is the load too much?
I have also considered a steel frame with a concrete poured deck... a la Pierre Koenig. |
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cmkavala
Veteran Member
Posts:4327
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| 23 May 2008 10:38 AM |
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Posted By tlynch on 05/23/2008 10:30 AM
And here I am in the SIPs forum...
Would it be possible to put a hollow core concrete roof on top of a SIPS Structure? Or is the load too much?
I have also considered a steel frame with a concrete poured deck... a la Pierre Koenig. I think you are in the wrong forum, this "the most efficient building envelope method" thread would not normally be meant to include earth covered SIPs more like: mining, bomb shelters, tunnel construction forums are a little more in line with what you are looking to build and most certainly are not efficient |
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| Chris Kavala<br>[email protected]<br>1-877-321-SIPS<br /> |
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