Just want to know if the plastic ties used in icf walls will hold cement siding up using an air nailer or will the board be too heavy for the ties

Don't know about any other brands, but I'm planning on hanging Hardiplank on my Buildblock walls. I will be using spiral siding nails and a Makita coil siding nailer. I plan to put the nails into every reinforced segment of every web. I did a test a few ago by nailing a piece of Hardiplank to a block using spiral nails into the reinforced segments of three webs. I then pulled on the bottom edge of the Hardi. The nail heads pulled through the Hardi and the nails remained firmly embedded in the web. The webs are spaced 6" apart horizontally and the reinforcements are spaced 8" apart vertically. I'll be using 9 1/4" Hardi with 8" exposure blind nailed every 6".

bbicf,

You shouldn't worry much about the cement board being to heavy for the ICF ties, as they are extremely strong. I did a very quick search on screw pull out tests and came up with the following:

Quad-Lock

Screw Pull Out Test #L19214
Findings:

Shear Tests conducted at -40°C (-40°F) using #6 drywall screws is an average maximum shear strength of 86kg (190lbs)
Pull-out Tests conducted at -40°C (-40°F) using #6 drywall screws is an average maximum shear strength of 59kg (130lbs)
Shear Tests at -35°C (-31°F) using #6 drywall screws is an average maximum withdrawal strength of 73kg (160lbs)
Pull-out Tests at -35°C (-31°F) using #6 drywall screws has an average maximum withdrawal strength of 45kg (100lbs)

NOTE: ICBO Evaluation has allowed for a safety buffer and reports: Fasteners have an allowable pullout capacity of 17kg (38lbs) and an allowable lateral capacity of 35kg (77lbs).


Amvic has a pull out test rating of 198 lbs which is pretty stout.

That being said, I would suggest that you use screws rather than a nail gun when putting up the siding.

renangle

That was my original plan but I couldn't find collated cement board screws for a screw gun, and I didn't want to drive them one at a time from a bucket. After I did some testing I became convinced that nails, particularly in the Buildblock reinforced segment, would hold very well. In building my house I have found that screws can be tricky in that it is very easy to strip them in the web. Don't have that problem with nails. My personal preference based on my experience. Doesn't mean I believe it's the only or best method!

Also, I found that the spiral nails hold better in ICF webs than do ring shank nails, just like in wood.

I know of contractors that have used Certainteen Weatherboards Siding over their ICF walls with excelent results. Send me a message if you would like photos.

bb.
I have installed hardiplank over ICF's. Don't worry about the webs being strong enough to hold up siding. Sometimes when I am using my hammer to pull a screw out of a web that has a stripped head, I wonder if it would be easier to pull the screw out if it was in wood. I'm saying that to give an example of how tough the webs are.
Whether or not you want to use screws or spiral nails is up to you. They would both work.
If I was doing it, I would use screws.

Whenever I have someone question the holding power of webs, I drive a 16d framing nail 2/3 the way into web, hand the hammer to the questioning party, and ask them to pull the nail out. That answers the question. Everyone agrees that its harder to pull out of the web than a 2x4.

I have a siding contractor asking me about nailing on Hardi-plank with ring shanks. Has anyone ever had a problem when nailing on siding? Especially cement board?

In my experience, and in my opinion, screws are best. Check out the line of GRK screws. Their cabinet screw has a profile which should be shallow enough. Barb4

We have used both nails and screws in Hardi products,both seem to do fine in the Pacific NW.The siders seem to gravitate towards nails, go figure:)

Posted By ICFconstruction on 11 Mar 2010 03:04 PM
I have a siding contractor asking me about nailing on Hardi-plank with ring shanks. Has anyone ever had a problem when nailing on siding? Especially cement board?

If he doesn't want to use screws, for whatever reason, I think spiral nails would be better than ring shank. The little bit of testing I did before I sided my house showed that the rings in ring shanks get filled in with the material they're passing through, making them much the same as smooth shank nails. So far, 18 months later, I see no problems with my Hardiplank nailed on with spiral siding nails on every web. In a test of holding power the plank pulled off of the nail with the nail not giving at all.

Spiral nails are what are used to assemble wood pallets. Ever try to pull any of them out? You pretty much can't.

BuildBlock also recommends screwing on the siding, "#8 fine thread screws 12" oc". Which I agree with, but I always thought course thread held better, what do ya'll think?

Are most of you just installing it directly to the wall or over some sort of furring strip to gain an airspace between siding and wall? If using furring what attachment is recommended?

psammy

Direct to ICFs.

Screws are best but i have seen ring shank work fine -- BUT (however), you should really check with your local code official. A few years ago we had one demand (successfully) that the material be removed and that screws must be used. Incidentally, the stayed in the furring strips and ripped through the hardi when it was removed. Go figure. REgards.

Just saw ICFconstruction post above regarding fine thread.  I utilize a different ICF but would NOT use fine thread for ICF -- not a good idea.  Fine thread is not a good idea for the same reason as fine thread screws intended to attach sheetrock to steel studs are a bad idea.  The threads are so fine that they will turn in place if the drill motor is not stopped at the correct time.   If you have the right screw it will attempt to embed itself in the material.  Regards.