Dana
Registered Users
Posts:15
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| 11/14/2001 4:32 AM |
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I am planning on using Eco-Block for my home, not because I think it is the best, but because I have the most experience with it and have an excellent installer. My question when siding the exterior, do you need to add wood strips to attach the siding or can you go by the book and attach the siding right to the plastic ties. I would like to hear from people with real world experience with Eco-Block.
THanks,
Dana |
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LARRY
Registered Users
Posts:123
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| 11/14/2001 7:40 AM |
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quote:
I am planning on using Eco-Block for my home, not because I think it is the best, but because I have the most experience with it and have an excellent installer. My question when siding the exterior, do you need to add wood strips to attach the siding or can you go by the book and attach the siding right to the plastic ties. I would like to hear from people with real world experience with Eco-Block.
THanks,
Dana
It may be a little more costly in to use furring strips, but it makes things a little easier once they are installed. I've never used Eco-block, but I have witnessed siding installation on eco in 3 different applications. In one instance furring strips were used and none were used on the other 2.
See "cedar siding installation" post
Larry
Edited by - larry on 11/14/2001 07:44:15 |
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ICF372
Registered Users
Posts:219
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| 11/14/2001 9:40 AM |
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I too have never used eco-block, but it makes no differance which form is used. That is with forms like eco. If you strip the wall out you lose the solid surface backing of the foam. There is a small space atop each tie where you will not be able to attach. Choose a siding size that can lay out, and attach above that foam space. We have used metal straps in between the ties and that works well.
Eldon Howe |
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Eldon Howe
Howe Construction
Total Concrete Homes provide positive cash flow , DAY ONE . |
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wickid.r
Registered Users
Posts:4
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| 11/14/2001 5:02 PM |
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| So your saying that you wouldn't advise stripping out the wall? Or ,in your applications you have not. Also did you screw the siding or nail? Robb |
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Unregistered
Registered Users
Posts:2321
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| 11/14/2001 5:58 PM |
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quote:
I too have never used eco-block, but it makes no differance which form is used. That is with forms like eco. If you strip the wall out you lose the solid surface backing of the foam. There is a small space atop each tie where you will not be able to attach. Choose a siding size that can lay out, and attach above that foam space. We have used metal straps in between the ties and that works well.
Eldon Howe
Dear Eldon,
I just a clairification, can you screw directly into a plastic tie. I wanted someone who has experience with this. I just came from my builder who is adimately opposed to this technology and he says you will have to put wood up on the sides. I am not sure on how I want to proceed. Let me know.
Thanks,
Dana J. Ritchie |
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ICF372
Registered Users
Posts:219
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| 11/14/2001 6:35 PM |
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| By all means screw most sidings and dryway directly to the plastic webbs inside and out. Although nails will work why risk it. Your structure will be around long after we are. If your builder is opposed to icf's, why then would you use the dinosaur? He dosn't even want to give you what you want!!! Instead invite him over on a cold windy winter night, or on a very hot day. And show him the wonderfully comfortable icf home that he didn't get to build. |
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Eldon Howe
Howe Construction
Total Concrete Homes provide positive cash flow , DAY ONE . |
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365
Registered Users
Posts:36
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| 11/15/2001 10:07 AM |
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| First of all what part odf the country are you located in. If you are in an area where you have heavy freezing rain or prolonged freezes and thaws the main concern you will have is expansion and contraction of the water possibly collected behind the wall. I agree with your builder. I would screw pressure treated strips or possibly steel hat channel to the furring strips. You want to leave about and inch of space between the foam and the siding. I just received a call from up north where a gentleman was replacing the siding on a house because freezing temps. forced the siding off. I'm sure ECO has their way of doing it and I have mine but your builder is the one installing it. Have him call the rep at ECO block and get something from them on how they want it done. 214-503-1644 |
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ICF372
Registered Users
Posts:219
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| 11/15/2001 11:04 PM |
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Wow that is amazing.
Siding sure acts differantly in various area around the country. We installed cheap vinyl siding on poly-steel home over 10 years ago for a customer. And every thing still looks fine. I can't see how icf construction could be any differant than stud walls with osb and foam sheathing. The siding is still resting directly agianst foam. Why would the siding act differently? Most all sidings in midwest Michigan are attached directly against the sheathing. The bottom line here is install your siding just as a conventional builder would do" in your area". Just use a course thread screw.
Eldon Howe
Edited by - icf372 on 11/15/2001 23:06:43 |
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Eldon Howe
Howe Construction
Total Concrete Homes provide positive cash flow , DAY ONE . |
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panelbuilt
Registered Users
Posts:52
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| 11/18/2001 1:45 PM |
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One of the problems with new building technologies is trying to keep the costs
in line with conventional building methods. Having to add furring strips so you can install siding defeats the cost effectiveness.
As our ICF of preference is TF, we have not had any issues with siding attachments. There are vertical steel ladders every 12 inch on center and we have used both a barbed nail and used screws with equal success. We are anal about installing a mositure barrier but do not recognize the need for a vapor barrier which we apply directly over the ICF and the siding directly over that.
Hard for me to imagine it wouldn't be the same
for all ICF systems. I'd like to see more feed back on the reason one would use furring strips. |
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markross
Registered Users
Posts:1035
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| 11/19/2001 9:29 PM |
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Eldon;
Have to go with you on this one bud. I have wood siding, vynil, pressboard etc. on ICF homes in the far reaches of Northern Ontario, I think I can justly say that nails work, and work well. As for siding peeling from the walls, with fastening strips at 8" or closer o/c, installers have a lot more to fasten to than good ole 16" centered studing. But hey, dont take my word for it, look at some of our site projects at www.arit.com, I am sure you will find a home with the type of siding you are installing, for which I will gladley refer contact info for.
Mark Ross
"Le Canuck" |
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Rick Hansen
Registered Users
Posts:22
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| 11/21/2001 8:19 PM |
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Furring strips are recommended by most wood siding manufacturers, but few ICF manufacturers. The recommendation does not apply to only icf foam or foam sheathing over studs, but to applications over any substrate. Siding and paint or stain is said to last several times longer on a furred out base with air space behind. Consider that standard installations for wood shakes used to be over furring strips, but most contractors now skip the expense and apply flat to the roof substrate. We have one roofing company that will guarantee wood shakes for fifty years - he uses top quality shakes and furring strips. Most wood shake roofs have a expected life span similar to asphalt shingles, about fifteen years. It isn't that the siding won't stay on the substrate, it is that it will look better longer and not need replacing near as soon. Wood over furring strips makes good economic sense. See: Journal of Light Construction, October 1996 for one reference.
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markross
Registered Users
Posts:1035
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| 11/21/2001 11:34 PM |
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Well Rick you got me there.
Never really thought about wood siding in this way. I guess when we consider we are building a home to last a long time, we should consider what may be required to help the siding last a long time. I quess the only other solutions are stone or stucco (mortared).
Mark Ross
"Le Canuck" |
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Rick
Registered Users
Posts:157
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| 11/22/2001 9:46 AM |
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| What about vinyl siding? Wouldn't furring strips allow the siding to flex with temperature changes, therefore showing the airspace behind? (assuming vertical furring strips) |
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