I've done a few searches - google and GB talk forum - and I haven't found any solid answer.
Has anybody used travertine in a cold climate with regular freeze and thaw cycles? I would be using chiselled and tumbled tile, sealed for weather protection.

Posted By GAW on 13 Jul 2010 08:49 AM
I've done a few searches - google and GB talk forum - and I haven't found any solid answer.
Has anybody used travertine in a cold climate with regular freeze and thaw cycles? I would be using chiselled and tumbled tile, sealed for weather protection.

GAW;

travertine is marble, marble is porous and absorbs water, so it is no good for exterior use only interior

..even with proper sealer application? I hear that as long as no moisture gets through to cause ice forming within the tile, it should be good.

The problem with travertine (I assume you are talking about the material that comes from Tivoli, just east of Rome) is that it is filled with veins and pores. You can get "filled" travertine where they wipe a special grout over the surface and then polish or hone it, but it really does not provide a seal.

I would not consider travertine a suitable exterior floor material in a freeze thaw environment, especially not tiles. They might last one season. If you are thinking of it for interior use, use the filled material. Keeping the unfilled material clean is a problem.

My company has thousands of square feet of interior and exterior stone floors. We generally do not like marble for exterior paving (although we have used it)...and NEVER tiles. Marbles are generally softer than granites and they do not hold up as well thus requiring more maintenance, although the travertine material iteself is reasonably hard. We have a lot of interior and exterior travertine in Houston that has been in place for almost 40 years...and it is high maintenance.

Because of the veins and pores, travertine is inherently weaker than a more homogenous material. It cracks easily. Accordingly, it requires thicker pieces. I personally would not use travertine tiles on the floor...inside or outside. The Romans used it for paving in the right way...in big, thick pieces (and it seldom freezes in Rome).

Bruce

GAW;

even if you could seal surface you still need to contend with grout  joints , both sanded and unsanded grouts are not waterproof, epoxy grouts are messy and if you get the slightest water penetrationb the travertine will start to pop off with the freeze -thaw cycle.
Just a bad application

Thanks for the detailed answers!
Will stay away from travertine then.

A similar question - can you put any tile over concrete in an outdoor situation in a freezing climate? I suspect that loose pavers would be a good way to go (no chance of them being detached).

If stone tiles (I am thinking 30cm x 30cm x ±6-8mm) are not fully supported, they will crack easily so I would not use them loose. Don't forget these surfaces must stand up to snow removal and de-icing salts. For me, the problem with these tiles is the thickness. A 30cm x 30cm x 15mm tile would have a much higher safety factor.

We always use a thickset sand/cement bed for stone paving and make sure it is well grouted. Brick or concrete pavers are good choices anywhere. Many European cities use precast pavers (30cm x 30 cm) for their sidewalks.

Whenever you use stone paving, be very careful until it is grouted. Until it is grouted, the edges are not supported and it is easy chip the edges and corners if you roll a loaded dolly over it.

Bruce

Quarry tiles with epoxy grout .......... the simplest way to find out is to go to a local commercial tile outlet and have the experts advise you (I don't mean Home Depot)