I know the members on this board are big on various concrete floor systems but if you were to pick a non-concrete floor system to go with ICF, which one would that be and why? Dietrich? TJI? floor trusses?

Orono,

For simplicity, ease, and ready availability...TJIs are tough to beat. I don't like their resistance to fire. For that, if I was using lumber I would go with a traditional dimensional lumber floor.

Web truss, bottom chord, top chord they are all viable options but are typically more expensive. Take more lead time and are typically not readilly available depending on where you live. They still have less resistance to fire.

The composite rolled sheet metal systems have always been disasters as far as the ease of installation goes. Some companies have suspect engineering and I have personal experience with a project that has a concrete deck poured over the system that is failing even before the home is built. So I personally would never choose one of these systems. I think contractors who build with them everyday can do a fine job but the ocassional installer is behind the curve. Many of these companies have very poor after purchase customer support.

Just my two cents

ICF Contractor

Icfcontractor,

In your caution on composite concrete floor systems, would include Speed floor and Hambro as trouble?

As you have likely read in my posts, we are panning on using Hambro.

Patrick T

Patrick,

I have not used any of the bar joist systems. I see there are a lot of the people on this site that love their bar joist systems of which Speed floor and Hambro are mentioned. The only negative I have heard about them is in specific design conditions you can get a bounce in the floor. From what I understand is this can be engineered out but you need to use an engineer that understands the issue. I have found that the engineers for specific products usually have their own best intrests in mind and not yours so I always hire my own engineer. I have a project this fall that will have the Hambro system so I will be able to give a better opinion then.

ICF Contractor

SpeedFloor is not a "bar joist system".  I have installed many sq. ft. of SpeedFloor and never experienced any "bounce"! It is a very easy to install system that can be set by your own existing crew.  We did a 4 floor motel without a crane using SpeedFloor for 3 floors and a flat concrete top.  We did use a Lull to lift them to the floor.  They were all set using "man power". 

I have designed concrete floor slabs using various types of joists.

I have heard complaints about the bounce in the concrete floor before the completion of the whole job. Personally I believe that once the flooring is installed, the partition walls are in, all the architectural appurtenances are in, and the funiture is in, the bounce will not be noticed, or at least it would not be found to be objectionable. During structural design, one should also look into the length, and width of the floor panels, the thickness of the slab and the associated properties of the supporting structure to avoid resonant frequencies.

 

 

I have a preference for concrete floor systems, but when not an option I do like using steel floor joists, Dietrich makes a decent product as well as Cemco, I have this habit of embeding the ends of the C channel directly into the foam wall prior to pour supported by a temporary 2x4 ledger board, make sure you punch holes into the ends prior to installation and then thread a piece of rebar through from one end to the other as addition grab support for the concrete. Using this method I normally get the subfloor installed and two more courses of block prior to pour, when you pour, don't go more than a few inches above the bottom of the flood joist. The best part is, when you done your first pour your ready to start stacking block again. Some guys think this is excessive work, but consider the cost of the Rim Board, Simpson ICFLC or time to install AB's and then after the pour set the ledger I like my system

Chris