Do you guys use Form-a-drain, why or why not? Have you tried the new stuff, Forma-Corr?

I don't use as much Form-A-Drain much anymore, I am doing more with key-ways. I think a key-way helps with water proofing and it eliminates some of the dowels. Does anyone use do a key-way in Form-A-Drain?

Where or who is Forma-Corr? Haven't seen that one yet.

We get stuck with both key ways and verticals...still

Drainage industries makes Forma-corr. I am usually allowed either keyway or dowels. Is there a good way to do a keyway with Form-A-Drain?

You could do a keyway the same as a framed footing, you just to be carefull how much weight to apply to the Form-a-drain so as to not distort it.

As to a keyway stopping water, won't happen without a "waterstop", which is rarely used for residential. However, here's a bigger picture. If you use a waterproofing membrane of some type, and believe you need the keyway to "help" it for lack of a better word, then you are using the wrong waterproofing product.

I ignore dampproofing as a cheap and tacky approach to proper building, but that's my opinion. I always spring for the waterproofing, especially if it is defined as "livable" space.

Water proofing redundancy, a couple membranes, that is what I recomend, likewise it is more difficult for water to pass through the most susceptible part of the foundation.

For key-ways I hang a 2x4 from spreaders. For Form-A-drain it would be more difficult to screw spreaders to it. How do you guys do key-ways.

Have you ever waterproofed the top of the footing between the wall the footing? I hear this anti-wick is a LEED point, do you think it would make it more difficult for water to penetrate the cold joint?

"Have you ever waterproofed the top of the footing between the wall the footing?"

Every time....EVERY time! The intent of the waterproofing is to prevent water from "traveling" thru or on concrete. Now although concrete can wick water pretty far, I don't have that particular problem because I use FastFoot, although I did use Form a drain for a long time. I always liked Formadrain, I just changed because of field issues. In any event, I still use a footing drain, so the water stays at or below the footing bottom.

The waterproofing has to cover the footing/wall joint for any warranty I have ever seen! That is why I said the keyway is beyond the protection plane.

I gave up suspending the 2x, I cut it in after the pour, first pass as soon as the concrete is poured, about 30-40 mins later cut it again when the mud is setting up. Same with the waterstop, set it into the wet mud. That's about the only two things I think I can actually do during the pour, everything else (AB's, SSTB's, etc) has to be secured in place prior to pour.

Chris,
Do you just scoop out concrete with a mag to make a key-way? What kind of water stop do you use? What is "AB's, SSTB's"?

I just use a 2x4 and cut it, the lazy way. I really don't think it does anything, some engineers require it, others don't. I'm not sold on it's purpose. My footing has 'bulged' mud around the dowels, but it has no effect on the placement of the wall.

Waterstop can be any piece of vinyl, usually 6" x 1/4", again some engineers call for it, others (most) don't.

AB's - Anchor Bolts, SSTB's - Hold Down Bolts. Any piece of hardware embedded into the concrete wall I have to place before pour, no wet setting of anything.

Is there any wick resistant coating that we can put on a key-wayed footing that will also help prevent leakage through the cold joint? what about bentonite?

I don't water-proof my foundations, I can't without a GC lic. So I want do as much as I can to prevent water problems.

I prefer to mono-pour my footings with the 1rst/2nd row of ICF 'stem-wall' all at once. Its a little extra in labor and materials but in most circumstances it becomes a 'wash' because I then am able to eliminate 1 concrete pour (stemwall) and the excavator/framers are able to come in right away to backfill and set their floors. Doing a mono-pour is ideal in my opinion because it completely relocates the cold joint to a level that is usually above grade. Another benefit of a mono-pour is if I have structural engineering that calls for dowels in the footing to match up with vertical rebar on the left and right of my openings I have the ability to accurately layout the openings and place my footing 'j-bars'/Dowels very accurately.

pcoughlin,
That is a good idea, but for me, almost everything here gets a basement.

Just curious, where are you guys pouring your foundations, in Atlantis? I trowel of a nice smooth footing wet set my rebar dowels and build wall. I make sure my water proofing (peel'n'stick) covers my footing, put down 4" sock tile and cover with 6" of gravel. I make sure to tell the homeowner that if given the chance water will penetrate through absolutely anything so make sure that you have a good slope away from your home and get your eaves and downspouts installed as soon as possible. And so far, 9 years and counting, no call backs for leaky basements.
I only ever used a key way when I was building conventional foundations during summers off from university. And back then I was told that was to stop the foundation from kicking in during backfill.
I guess it all depends on where you work, I know that Chris can't have a cigarette on site with out the engineers approval, maybe I am just lucky!!
Paul Stevens

The main purpose of a key way is to prevent the wall from sliding in from back-fill pressure, with one we can install fewer or no rebar dowels. I usually still use some, but when they are 2' oc they get in the way and I am thinking a key way will lessen the likelihood of water following the cold joint.

In my area of Minnesota we have heavy clay. I don't do the water-proofing and even though I recommend two membranes, they don't always do it. This time of year the ground is frozen except next to the house and we get heavy rains, so it comes down next to the house. I want to do everything I can.

Here's one to dwell on...I just can't believe what really happened...

We are working on a commercial project, typical California slab on grade with perimeter footings, footings throughout the structure where bearing walls are and a number of piers for the point load columns. We have an elevator pit to build and pour. Engineer plan calls for 15x24 footing with A) Dowels 12" o.c. B) Key way C) Waterstop D) Waterproofing between wall and backfill area.

Engineer shows up for pre-pour inspection, comments to me that he needs to see the waterstop installed prior to approval. I always bring it on pour day, keep it on site before hand and it looks like nothing and someone will throw it out. He proceeds to tell me if I mono pour the shaft walls, footing/slab of pit in one shot no waterstop is needed. I ask him if I am suppose to excavate again to get waterproofing in after the fact. He says, don't worry about it, if you mono pour nothing is needed...I say give me that in writing...sure enough he did and we delayed to pour so we could build the pit walls...

That alone saved me well over $ 1000.00 between materials, 2nd pump trip day and labor. And I didn't need enginnering approval for the cigarette of joy.

What strength was the concrete? They say 4000 psi plus concrete does not wick water, so how would it resist hydrostatic pressure?

I don't care what the concrete strength is, shrinkage cracks in concrete will wick water all day long.

ICf construction:

With regards to your question about waterproofing the wall to footer connections, we have had volclay rx101 and 102 specified on jobs both footings and also wall/suspended concrete connections. Yes, it is a bentonite product.

They actually make it a mile from my house at American Colloid....

Kevin

Anyone ever use this?

http://www.kryton.com/products/admixture/krystol-internal-membrane

or their Waterstop system grout at basement footing/wall joints?

http://www.kryton.com/products/joint-waterproofing