Although I have built houses with ICFs before, we are now about to start on an ICF pool as part of  larger house build, with Quad Lock as the ICF. The pool base will be also concrete slab on ICF, namely Quad Deck, since it is on a terrace above a living space. The pool is small, 16ft by 8ft by 4 ft deep, and the engineering for steel/concrete has been done and certified.

I've read a pile of threads here on the subject of liners for an ICF pool and am still really confused as to the best approach.

1. I do NOT want to strip the inside ICF foam and render onto the concrete, that simply removes the insulation and makes the exercise pointless.
2. I don't believe the ICF surface will be  smooth enough to just drop a liner in.
3. Spraying Gunite seems to be overkill when the structural strength is all ready there.
4. The ICF faces are resonably 'soft' so some sort of rigid skin as well as waterproofing would appear to be required.
   

Here in this forum I've found a few references to spray on  membranes, such as truck bed liner(!), but am really interested in a rendercoat to smooth out  any imperfections and make rigid the ICF face, and then a thin topcoat of some kind.

Searching the web I have come across a product which seems ideal,  from a company called Sider-crete, Inc. They have a two part system specifically for ICF pools, described as: 'A cement based , polymer modified, waterproofing cement plaster system for ICF swimming pools comprised of  a flexible ICF mesh reinforced base coat and a roll on cement plaster finish'.

They have a website at www.sider-crete.com/pools_decks.htm which has a link to a.pdf describing the products in detail.

I am in Canada and they are in GA so visiting the or seeing any projects using the product is unlikely, so has anyone here seen or used this product? And, if so could they please comment.

Thank you,

I just noticed that on Quad Lock's home page they have a pool x section, using their ICFs, and interestingly they are showing sider-proof's products in use as the lining..

http://www.quadlock.com/images/insu...etails.jpg

I have emailed them for more detail, and will report back as to what transpires.

We are using Durock prep coat B2000 as the base coat, Durock is a Canadian company in north Toronto. Most ICF companies in Canada have this product as an accessory product available from them.

Posted By Chris Johnson on 25 Jun 2013 08:05 AM
We are using Durock prep coat B2000 as the base coat

Thanks Chris,

What are you using for the top coat? I had a quick look at their site and can see nothing pool related.

BTW I had a reply from Quad-lock yesterday, in which they say:

We have been working with Sider-Crete for about 2 years now. In short, their products are the best ICF render coatings I have ever seen. We have had customers in USA, the Caribbean, & UK apply their hard-coat stucco and gypsum products on exterior, interior, and pool surfaces with 100% success.

I fired off an email request to Sider-Crete and have had a reply this morning, unless anyone here can give me good reason to go 'elsewhere' I think that is the route I will go down.  I'm in Osoyoos, BC BTW, so shipping costs may be the only deterrent. I will report back here when I know.

If you call Durock, ask for Pino, he is the resident expert in their products for pools.

They do have a top coat available, or you can put in a liner if you want over the B2000. If you go the liner route, form the top 2" of the pool with regular form ply or 2x material, you need the concrete exposed to attach the rail to that connects to the liner.

I'm not saying anything detrimental about the Sider-Crete, but you hit the nail on the head, if no one regularly orders from them and ships into your area, you will be paying a shipping premium, where as with Durock products, most local ICF companies deal with them which should alleviate shipping concerns

Here is some additional liner info:

http://insulatedpoolkits.com/liners.asp also an active pool forum: http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/pools/?19811

http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/pools/?19811

also an active pool forum

Been a while guys busy with work and family, we have done quite a few pools now, the Sider-Crete is good as long as you don't use anything like a chemical free pool etc otherwise they fail completely. One of our pools we used Sider on had a chemical free "Swim Fresh" pool (Basically the water flows over a block of copper which kills algae and a block of Magnesium connected to electrodes which eliminates body oils).
We are now talking to Pebble-Tech about using their product, and would most likely use it over Chris' suggestion or even Durock boards taped at seams whats your thought on that Chris?
It's been so long and this Sleezen guy is still hounding this site trying to sell his crap LOL.

Best
Jay

Jay with the Pebble Tech would you apply it directly to the ICF or do you need a pre coat of something?

Yes needs a precoat with mesh or durock

An update. Well, we went the Sider Crete route, and I have to say I was very unhappy with it. The pool was rendered with two coats of Sider Base, with their fiberglass mesh encased and then two top coats. Exactly as per their spec. When filled it leaked and the coating appeared to be porous. 

I emailed Sider Crete who never replied.

Rather than bother trying to work out what was wrong, I decided to apply epoxy pool paint over the Sider Crete after pressure washing it/and degreasing it. We applied a base coat of Pool Grip Epoxy Primer and then 2 coats of Pool Guard Epoxy High Build, all from ipaint.us, and I am happy to say there have been no leaks since.

Sorry to hear that Colin I did say they aren't good, We have started using ONLY PebbleTec its expensive but so very good. We did some tests without a bisect and have very good lamination but at this point we are sticking with basecoat with mesh.

Look us up on Facebook Hampton's Insulated Concrete Homes plenty of videos etc on Pools (PebbleTec finish) and pond (Polyurea finish)

HamptonsICF I checked out your videos, lovely work, very impressive. What do you think is the final evaluation on an ICF pool versus gunite? Is it all about the insulation value, or do you think it speeds up the construction process versus gunite? Is the price for the consumer comparable?

A simple product to use is surface bonding cement. I've used a lot of it. It's harder than hell and a persons' toe nail won't go thru it. It's widely available at the big homarama stores or a place that sells blocks and motor. It's about $10 for a 75 sq ft bag

Cheers Jelly, It costs around the same but the insulation value can't be overlooked if the ground is 55 degs and you're heating your pool to 85+ here in NY.
You hardly have to use the heater, we install much smaller heaters, couple all this with a good insulated cover (we install automatic ones that lock) and for the price of a summer season they can use it for spring and fall too.
Also when installing gunite you have to wait 3 weeks for the shell to cure before you install finish, with ICF there is no waiting.
On all of our projects we pour walls and floor in one pour so its very strong.
Smartwall (Sorry don't know your name) we use Sto stucco base or durock with a good strong mesh but you can use anything that will give a good bond.

Hope this help

Thanks for the great info....and nice videos

Colin: I just reviewed our server and did not find the email you mentioned you sent regarding any technical issues you had encountered with our ICF plaster system. The last email I received from you was regarding product delivery. With an increasing number of ICF pools we have supplied every year without any issues, I am interested to find out details about your application. We do take all technical inquiries and support to our customers very seriously and have been very diligent about answering all emails. Our ICF pool plaster system is waterproof, has shown great results for ICF application for now many years and received great reviews. We simply need a fair opportunity to address any issues. Sincerely, Ivan Burgand - Sider-Crete, Inc.

Colin after having the Sider-Crete fail on us too I would be inclined to believe you, Ivan wasn't particularly helpful when we had a problem either.
I've been in this game for nearly 30 years and know what CYA means, don't use their products and your risk goes down.

IvanB.

Here is a copy of the email I sent to your email address on: Mon Aug 03 19:00:12 2015. After 3 coats of epoxy pool paint it is now watertight despite the failing(s) of the Sidercrete coats.

Colin

Hi Ivan,

I'm looking for advice.. The pool which was formed on a roof above habitable space, using/engineered with QuadDeck and QuadLock blocks has some small weeping leaks into the room below. Just occasional drops, but because water can travel through the voids in the QuadDeck it is hard to visualize where the leak(s) are. . I was present last fall when the 2 base-coats with fiber-glass mat were laid, and the 2 subsequent coats, all were as per directions on your website. I saw no 'uncovered' areas at that point.

The pool is currently full of water, but I am about to drain it and inspect for any evidence of a crack or leak. I notice that you have various sealants to waterproof potable water tanks etc on your site, I wonder if you can suggest a product/strategy that might solve the problem?

I'm also considering trying one of the various crack sealers advertised for concrete pool leaks by pool companies, (rather like car radiator sealant) you add the liquid to the water and it gets sucked into the leak, supposedly sealing it.

Again, any thoughts?

Thanks,

Colin