Dick;

ya gotta love that technical stuff!   ; )

Posted By cmkavala on 14 Feb 2010 09:35 PM
Dick;

ya gotta love that technical stuff!   ; )

Chris, here is some technical stuff:

http://www.dragonboard.com/wallproduct-standards-test-reports.php

It does not address the corosion problem but it is clear that the MGO does not compare with O.S.B

Liviu;

I found this excerpt on Injuryboard.com

"A respondent to IB News- Honolulu says that the wallboard may actually be Chinese magnesium oxide board, also called Mag Board, MgO Board and Dragon Board. Wet it and it releases magnesium chloride, corrosive to metal, he says. Heat it and it releases magnesium oxide fumes."

Read more: http://www.injuryboard.com/national...z0fZTi7Xhc

I have done alot of research on this subject..I take my business vey serious and so has the MgO Association of China our partners are the president and vice-president..there is not one ingredient in drywall that is in MgO board..and ABC news put out a reprt that US drywall has been known to do the same thing..this is a drywall issue not a MgO board issue..take that to the bank...Chrsi if you actually tried MgO Board from a reputable manufacturer you might not dog it you might embrace it as an up and coming technology that actually has merit and value.. its not a cure all but a good alternative skin with many uses

MagDaddy;

I only did a cursory search and found the same info on a Materials safety Data sheet form 2003 , it seems that the MGO board is good for fire resistance, but don't get it wet while in a fire or it could explode.

More wives tales..water is bonded into the board during the curing process we have tested it wet and dry and burned for over 3 hours at 2000 degrees and nothing happens..I have ASTM testing on our board from Intertek on both wood and steel full scaole E-119's and we have a 2 hour fire rating for both..I will send them to you if you would like

Dear all,

I am a supplier of MgO boards from China. I believe Chris is ignorant of MgO boards. He is skeptical for anything made in China. There are good MgO boards and poor ones, frankly. But the top ten suppliers are all reliable. Their products are free from brine leach problem in wet conditions. Two kinds of treatment for the erossive effects: soaked in water to drive out the MgCl2; special modifiers that confine MgCl2 in cells. I prefer the former and traditional treatment.

The drywall scare last year was caused by Knauf Tianjin's gypsum boards. Gypsum boards are much inferior to MgO boards.

Believe me.

Sam Shan

MagDaddy;

I know it does not burn, however I don't write the "wives tales" , I am simply refering to a materials safety data sheet, produced by a MGO manufacturer. see link

http://www.hillbrothers.com...remium.pdf

Sam the Sham;

I may be ignorant about the therory of relativity, brain surgery and MGO boards! but I can read, I would ask that both you and MagDaddy, explain away section 5 of the material safetey data sheet that addresses "FIRE FIGHTING  MEASURES".

If the both of you have a diferent type of MGO board then please post their material safety data sheets, and I am sorry Sam, but the Chinse have a poor record of products that comes from China such as childrens toys with lead paint, drywall, etc.,

Chris,

Typical stereotype. MgO board is not the dark side. It has many advantages over other drywalls. It is a very promising alternative building material. Don't be over-reacting to my words.

Sam

I have been watching this board with interest for quite some time; and wish to briefly add my 2 cents...

1.) This forum is dedicated to ALTERNATIVE Building methods - which requires an open mind. MgO board might well be a better building product than other materials such as Drywall, OSB, as well as Hardie Board.

2.) Name calling as well as negative comments concerning "China is no good" should have no place here. We here in the U.S. are quite well known for our superior products (i.e. Asbestos, the Ford Pinto etc.); and therefore don't have much room for critique. We must do our DD (in a positive manner). Chris I know that you are better than that.

3.) I hope that this thread shall not follow the same path as the infamous "wood is no good" thread. (even though some very good points have been made there IMHO.).

I agree with Donnerwetter.

Technically, we should look at the Mgo board as a product in general. Like gypsum board/ dry wall, there should be an industry standard being established for the mgo based sheeting material. China has a National Standard JC 688-2006 Glass Fiber and Magnessium Cement Board. The standard includes tests: bending strength and content of chlorine ion.

I don't know if any other countries or ISO have similar standard for this type of product.

As far as the Florida dry walll issue, the media is improperly acted to guid public towards "Chinese dry wall". It should be the importer/supplier and the builder to make sure the material used is in accordance with local building code and health safety regulations.

There has been misconceptions about " Mgo board". In lots of situation, even with many major suppliers here in US for "Mgo board", are actually supplying different formula for different applications but all under" one test report or certification". They are virtually different products.

As far as the product is concerned, a single test from a lab only reflect the sample to be tested. If the product supplied comply with the material tested is anothe story.

Before we contune this discussion any further, we should narrow down the definition of Mgo board.

Then we know that we are talking about the same thing.

Wayne Zhang, what does a Cl- content of less than 10% mean? In practical terms. Is it a measure of free Cl (or MgCl2) in the board? Is it by weight? I don't have a copy of the standard, but a quick google search seems to indicate that this 10% number is some sort of maximum.

Posted By cmkavala on 14 Feb 2010 10:30 PM
Liviu;

I found this excerpt on Injuryboard.com

"A respondent to IB News- Honolulu says that the wallboard may actually be Chinese magnesium oxide board, also called Mag Board, MgO Board and Dragon Board. Wet it and it releases magnesium chloride, corrosive to metal, he says. Heat it and it releases magnesium oxide fumes."

Read more: http://www.injuryboard.com/national...z0fZTi7Xhc

Chris,

To me it seems weird to believe an article in the newspaper but not to trust what ASTM test results are. I think we should be more open to new products and try to see how we can benefit from them. I think every product has good parts and bad parts and some of those  bad parts can be avoided if we want to.

Are there any 'big name' building material companies distributing MGO board in the US?

It seems odd that current suppliers are startup companies--if MGO board is as attractive as its proponents insist, it would seem natural that the big name material providers would enter the market.

DM: The content of Chlorine Ion shall be maximum 10% by weight if it doesn't specify v/v.

Liv: How do you know the ASTM test report and the product we are talking about are matching?

As far as the structural panel/board material is concerned, based on the UK Timber Trade Assocaiton, the recongized materials are plywood, particleboard, OSB, and cement bonded particle board.

Cement bonded particle board like ARMOROC is UL listed as structural mineral board as well.

Fiberglass and Magenessium cement board(Mgo board) and Fibre Cement Board are not listed structural sheething material.

I am not sure what are requirements of the SIP skin, but if you are looking for something called structural panel, you may refer to a panel with structural stability and meeting the requirements of related ASTM testes per IBC code requirements.

Posted By Donnerwetter on 15 Feb 2010 01:40 PM
I have been watching this board with interest for quite some time; and wish to briefly add my 2 cents...

1.) This forum is dedicated to ALTERNATIVE Building methods - which requires an open mind. MgO board might well be a better building product than other materials such as Drywall, OSB, as well as Hardie Board.

2.) Name calling as well as negative comments concerning "China is no good" should have no place here. We here in the U.S. are quite well known for our superior products (i.e. Asbestos, the Ford Pinto etc.); and therefore don't have much room for critique. We must do our DD (in a positive manner). Chris I know that you are better than that.

3.) I hope that this thread shall not follow the same path as the infamous "wood is no good" thread. (even though some very good points have been made there IMHO.).

donnerwetter; did not say China was no good, I said.... "but the Chinese have a poor record of products" Name calling? Sam the Sham, I think I had a 60's flash back. I can take it and dish it out too ! When the claims are made that its, fireproof, water resistant and the next best thing since sliced bread. I think is fair to ask about the MSDS posted on line by a mfg. If there are various brands/types of MGO, I don't know that and I don't think the documentation has been presented that proves that it is or os not corrosive. For something that is so revolutionary, the drywall suppliers are not dropping their normal products and stocking mag board  only.....why not? In as much as I try not to use wood in our buildings,  I welcome an affordable non- wood structural floor sheathing to use, I looked at nylo-board , but can't justify the cost. Mag board could be the answer but it must first pass the litmus test. as Sam said I am ignorant on MGO, so please someone enlighten me on the corrosiveness, as my intention is to use over steel joist if compatable?

Posted By Liviu on 15 Feb 2010 03:37 PM

Chris,

To me it seems weird to believe an article in the newspaper but not to trust what ASTM test results are. I think we should be more open to new products and try to see how we can benefit from them. I think every product has good parts and bad parts and some of those  bad parts can be avoided if we want to.

Liviu;

To me it seems weird that you would respond to the newspaper story but not to a trustworthy MSDS sheet, I am trying get to the real story but, the ASTM is not going to address the corrosion issue.
I can't "look the other way"and use MGO if it has the potential to leach corrosive chemicals when it gets wet.

I am one of the fortunate builders that did not get sucked into the Chinese drywall debacle, I don't want to start using MGO with blinders on !

The content of Chlorine Ion shall be maximum 10% by weight if it doesn't specify v/v.

If that is an indication of free ions (not chemically bonded), then it seems like a lot. One MSDS that I found very quickly listed it's Cl- content at just under 9%. I would think any value above a fraction of a percent would be cause for using stainless fasteners, or zinc coated at least. On the other hand if that is simply the quantity of MgCl2 (or if it includes the covalently bonded chlorine), that would be a completely different metric (and perhaps somewhat meaningless).

Why is such a big deal this corosion? it is the same with the OSB, if it gets wet is garbage. With MGO just make sure it does not touch the metal.